6 Trees, Room design

[InsideOut]

hi, im looking to design a room to house 6 large trees to yield a pound or more each. My medium is coco and id grow them in 15 gallon pots using house & garden nutes. Ive never grown large trees using vertical lighting, but i have experience with large plants under horizontal hoods.

First, my room would be a room inside of a larger room, with foil-reflective 4x8 insulation boards lining the inside, and drywall on the outside.

Total wattage would be 5600w - nonaircooled, with a 14x10ft room thats 40 watts per/sq ft.
So I was thinking of reducing the room to 12x10 which would be 50 w per/sq ft but im not sure about that ^.

Strain would be Burkle and SSSDH.

My theory on the room is the entire room will act as a reflector using the foil boards, but im scared that @ 40watts per sqft, that the plants won't grow dense enough to produce quality trees and buds. On the other hand, reducing the room to 12x10 and 50watter per sq ft, the plants won't have the room to grow large enough, yet not overcrowd the room completely.

Any advice from tree growers would be great. What kind of wattage do run per room?

 

[whodi]

I'd go with the bigger room.. how do you plan on vegging.. is this prepetual .. how long do you veg?

15 gallons huge... you better be vegging 8 weeks at least if you're gonig that large if you want true TREEES

No T5's or CFL's should be present in this op

i wanna do a grow with those 10 gallon air pots.. and vertical.

 

[InsideOut]

Id have to veg for atleast 8 weeks. I want to flip them when they've hit my chin or nose.

Keep a small mom to take another 6 cuts when the time is right, or just take cuttings off the trees and preveg in another room.

Lightwise, there would be 2 x 1ks hps, and 6 600w hps. 2x 14,500btu ACs keeping it cool.

 

[whodi]

ya id go with the 14x10 if you plan to veg real big.. 1 guy on here does 3 trees horizontally under 2400 watts in a 10 x 10 got 4-6 pounds... 15 gallon coco as well

 

[*mistress*]

move those 600's in closer to the middle of the room... between the plants. an elbow a plant is very doable. veg for 4-6 weeks under same light regime. push in veg like would push in flower w/ the nutes; e.g., run @ full strength.

run 2k bare bulb + uvb&floros over-plants... ac...etc.

would mix in a sun master cool deluxe or warm deluxe or neutral deluexe; excellent metal halide for growing trees; especially if vegging same light as flowering. mixed @ 2:1 hps/mh. the eye conversion bulbs are also excellent for trees.

make sure you have fans blowing air in laminar + turbulent manner. under each ligh should be some type of high-velocity fan facing the ceiling.

vegging in same container that will be flower in is ++. can pull 1-2 per 5 gal bucket, w/ right cultivar, 6-8 wk veg. in 10 gal tote, simply stack 2-4 pieces of 1" styrofoam board (can get 4x8' sheet for ~10-15 coins; will make many spacers) until have 3-4" clearance between totes/pots/containers...

mixing corn meal gluten (9-0-0) into the media would not hurt. is excellent fungicide & supplies nitrogen to the vegging plant.

what type of ac will be used?

dehumidifier?

lots of air circulation? how many fans? do they blow laterally & vertically?

will there be training, thinning, pruning, staking , yo-yo'ing?

has a walk-way been arranged?

manuevering in tree rooms can be yoga/ballet...

do mock run, w/ lights on, & outline of mature plants sharp-ied/duct-taped to floor... will give ~(approximation) of room will have when they are 4+' wide & 6+" tall. will also give ~ temps, rh, etc...

key: no sense of hurry...

this may be helpful:
SYK's Killer Bucket System (KBS) Suggestion/Discussion Thread https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=121419
&
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=2380668&postcount=47

i wanna do a grow with those 10 gallon air pots.. and vertical.

does take time, but free bakery buckets, drilled ala kbs, work. still have ~xx kbs buckets. after drilling a million holes, they last forever in imagination. too many holes to just throw out... 3-8-1/2" bit works.

enjoy your garden!

 

[InsideOut]

thanks for chiming in mistress.

so what type of spacing is ideal for these trees? I can't understand how you'd have 5x5 trees, right next to each other without the branches and colas growing into each other and the bulbs. Seems like you'd have to have a 5x5 tree inside of a 6x6 space to give it a buffer space so the lights can sit in the middle.

 

[antimatter]

sounds like a good plan

 

[*mistress*]

thanks for chiming in mistress.

so what type of spacing is ideal for these trees? I can't understand how you'd have 5x5 trees, right next to each other without the branches and colas growing into each other and the bulbs. Seems like you'd have to have a 5x5 tree inside of a 6x6 space to give it a buffer space so the lights can sit in the middle.

ideally, no spacing. or, just enough spacing so that gardener can somewhat maneuver in room & plant limbs are not falling over onto ea other.

have to also know when to start flowering... dif for every strain; how much stretch, etc. will occur.

in some rooms, there may be only enough room to crawl around & balance beam in.

this is the point of plugging everything in, taping off 3-4-5 squares on the floor & running everything @ max operational capacity, for a couple days - before putting plants in there. this will give ~ parameters of room to work in, heat/temps, & air circulation.

rh will have to wait until plants are in there; but would definitely include a dehumidifier, if cant find an ac that demhumes very well. a 3x3 tree can transpire 1/2-1 gal a day - on a bad day. this water vapor should be taken out of room, so process can continue.

a 10'x10' room w/ 4 trees, in full flower, could have 5-10 gallons of water coming out of there per day. depends on temps, etc; but they will be pushing lots of water into the room.

here, ~6" are allocated for moving around the edge of the flower room. 2k+ vert, bare bulb. the plants are also on cheapo 'pot dolly's'. easier to shift on wheels, especially when dealing w/ big plants, w/ wet media; can be heavy.

just do mock run & should have better estimate of maintenance room & other variables.

enjoy your garden!

 

[InsideOut]

What do you think of this design. check the pic \/

12x18 room. 5x5 grow spots inside of 6x6 buffers for spacing.

5600 watt, 2x 1mh, 6 600w hps, possible addition of 4x 400 w hps. All cooled via AC and vertical fans.

I want to put lights near the middle of the plants, and I think id need spacing so that the plants didn't get burned. Perhaps 6x6 is too small, and id need 7x7, and a 21x14 room. Dual 1ks vertically one above the other would be perfect for lighting the middle of the plant and the top.

 

[*mistress*]

maybe, center those 600s between the rows of plants, not positioned back against the wall. want to use all 360* of your light.

the plants wont get burned from close proximity to lights. 1ks placed 2-6" away from bare bulb. problems arise when there is lack of air circulation. to be safe, would keep the part of the plant closest to the light ~6" away - never more than 1 foot away.

 

[mrdizzle]

the 600's are exactly where they need to be, they are suppose to light the back side of the plant, in the krusty lighting scheme. I have ran that exact same lighting set up, 3 dual 600wers and 2 1000ws. the plants will almost be touching so you cant move the 600ws in the middle of those plants, the center lights and the outside lights overlap where in the space between the plants.


that is the perfect 6 plant room, make sure you raise the plants at least a foot off the ground so you can go under them to work, even those its only 40wsqft it will blow your mind how bright it will be, the 8 different light sources rocks

are you sealing this room up? you wont need a 8wk veg if you are

 

[InsideOut]

hey dizzle are you saying the 14x10 room is perfect or the 12x18 room? I think 4x4 plants could work well in the 14x10, and 5x5 in the 12x18. I can only grow 6 plants legally, so I want to make them as big as possible, and Im building a room specifically around this. thanks for the replies.

 

[somebody041]

mistress thanks for chiming in here. your advice always carries obvious experience with it and i am always interested in what you have to say

 

[mrdizzle]

go with the 14x10, its almost 5 foot center you will be greatful for the extra room, you may start with one pound trees but after a cycle or two you will likely get more like 1.5lbs with a 8wk veg, are you sealing it?

 

[mrdizzle]

build the door so it opens out too

 

[JustanotherDave]

If memory serves...your numbers aren't bad IO...and the bulb wattage and placement is right.
I think Krusty said 5x5' up to 6x6' per plant in 5gal within a 5gal on top of at least a spacer of two 2x4's...so 3"...and he tripped at about nipple height. Krusty is 5' 10".

 

[whodi]

P L P L P L
L P L P L P

p = plant .. L = light

notice how 4 of 6 plants are getting 3 sides of light.

 

[InsideOut]

Yes, the room will be sealed w/ 2 14, 500 btu window ACs handling the cooling, and in my experience in this climate, humidity is tough to keep high, so im planning on setting up a fogger system, but I'll see once the room is rolling. Id like to keep RH around 60 to 70% for veg, and closer to 50 to 60 for flowering.

Ive read krusty say that little air circulation is best in order to keep the plants from transpiring to much leading to stress. Yet, mistress pretty much says the opposite, and that I should use a lot of air circulation. In my grow experience, ive used a lot of air circulation, so I'll most likely go that route.

WHOdi, i wouldn't rock that light setup unless I was running smaller bushes. In my design 2 of the plants are getting 4 sides of light, and the other 4 are getting 3 sides of light. In your setup, 4 are getting 3 sides of light, and 2 are getting 2 sides of light. Not to mention I like how my 1ks hit 4 plants.

 

[whodi]

your design doesn't light 3 FULL sides .. and you only get 4 sides of light if you use the extra 400's

 

[InsideOut]

i still think mines more beficial, 2 of my plants get 4 sources of light, all the other ones have 3. The most your plants will see is 3 light sources.

My 2 middle plants get 4 sources. Each of the 1ks hit them, and 2 600s on either side of the middle plants.

Although, i think your method would work well if using all 1ks.