2 week old Sharksbreath yellowing - Need A Hand

[MojoBobo]

Having a bit of trouble with my just 2 week old Sharksbreath. Yellowing edges on bottom growth. Not sure if its over-watering or N def.

MB


What is your experience level? Novice.

Your Equipment:

.1) Type and wattage of lights? One Longstar CFL Full Spectrum 105W.
.2) Distance from tops? approx. 6-8 inches.
.3) Reflector type? Bowl reflector.
.4) Is there a consistent fresh air supply? Yes.
.5) Do you have an exhaust fan and a circulation fan? Both.
.6) What are the bulb wattages, kelvin ratings, and schedule? 105W, 6200 lumens, 5000K, 1250mA, 24/0 schedule.

Your medium:
.7) Specific brand and type of soil, and anything you've added to it. Organic Soil, Sphagnum Moss, Worm Castings, Perlite, and Vermiculite in a 1:1:1:1.5:1.5 blend.
.8) Size of container. Five Gallon.
.9) Did you use peat pucks (or similar) to root clones or germinate seedlings? Yes, Jiffy Pellets.

Your nutrients and water:
10) Source of water? Distilled. What's it's ph before adjusting? 7
11) Method of checking water ph. PH Pen on order.
12) Method of adjusting water ph. Dolomite lime.
13) Specific brand and N-P-K ratio for each bottle. List dosages (quantity per gallon) and current feeding schedule. Fox Farm Big Bloom (as per fox farm feeding schedule insert) 2 tbl/gal once so far only.
14) How often are you watering between feedings, and how much per watering? Water - Feed - Water - Feed, etc. 2 cups per watering.
15) Any additives or tea's? No.
16) Are your ph levels stable, or do they fluctuate? Stable.
17) What is your ingoing water's ph? ...your runoff ph? Don't know either.
18) Do you foliar feed? If so, with what, how often, and at what time do you spray? Yes. Distilled H20 2x daily with excellent ventilation.

Your growroom:
19) Indoors or outdoors? Indoors.
20) What size of closet, room or hut? A Large Converted Uhaul Garment Moving Box.
21) What are the temps and humidity levels while lights are on? ...With lights off? 85 deg. F with 35-38% humidity with lights on. Never had lights off.
22) Have you seen signs of insects in the growroom? Never.

Your strain:
23) What strain are you growing? Sharksbreath Femmed.
24) From seeds or clones? Seed.
25) Is this an autoflower strain? No.

 

[ibjamming]

Several things... Too big a pot for a newbie...too much water...too much nutes. Your baby is drowning and burning up. It'll make it IF you don't water it again for like 2 weeks...AND...you stop the nutes until it's ready...probably a month or more with a pot that big. A beginner should start a seedling in a smaller pot until they get a feel for watering and soil moisture. Just leave it be for a couple of weeks and it should pull out of it.

Or...better yet...carefully take it out of that huge pot and put it into a fresh mix of your soil in about a 1/2 gallon pot and start over...ONLY watering it every few days. And then only a little...maybe a half cup. Just enough to keep it moist. You don't want to water so much as to make water come out the bottom. When it perks up...you'll know, it will start "reaching", the leaf tips will point up, not down like yours. When that starts, you can start watering until it comes out the bottom, but only every 3-4 days.

Overwatering is the biggest problem new growers need to master. My rule of thumb...give it HALF the water you think it needs.

 

[MojoBobo]

Thanks for the info man, I will be following your advice. 2 weeks though? I have read sooooo much conflicting data in the preceding month from so-called "experts" that I don't know if I'm comin' or goin'. Thought I was prepared....guess not, eh?

MB

 

[ibjamming]

It's not that hard...it really isn't. Just keep it simple...

You overwatered...EVERYONE does it...I've done it...I still have to fight it! OK...a few, very few, NEVER water and it dries out, they're probably too scared to overwater. That's a common problem too...people take the "let it dry out between watering" too literally. They overwater and then overdry which kills roots which then they overwater again. Uniformly moist soil is what I've found works best.

The trick to growing a plant is MOIST growing medium. Not wet, not dry.

2 cups of water in a 5 gal pot and a little tiny seedling is 2 cups too much. You don't say how often you watered...every day? Every other? A plant that small in 5 gals of soil will be able to go weeks without water. I usually give it just a spritz to keep the soil from drying out too deep.

That's why 5 gal for a seedling is not recommended...it takes forever for the plant to use up whatever moisture is in that much soil...and the top dries out too much for such a small seedling...understand? The top gets too dry...the bottom stays too wet. For a pot that size and a new seedling, you have to balance the watering so it only replaces the moisture in the upper levels without over soaking the lower soil. It takes HANDS ON PRACTICE...you don't read about it and know how to do it.

If you feel you can transplant it, do it. A smaller 1/2 gallon pot will be easier to keep uniformly moist without stagnation. If you're afraid you'll damage it, leave it alone and just LIGHTLY moisten the soil around the plant to keep the young roots from drying out. Just a bit every day if it's drying fast...a few tablespoons here and there if it dries out fast.

I think you have a good mix and it should do fine just cutting back the watering. But it's still tougher to regulate overall moisture with a small seedling and that much soil.

Just don't panic and kill it. It'll make it... Just watch the water.

 

[MojoBobo]

IBJ,

Well taken...thanks again for taking the time to post. Yes, I somehow managed to overlook the watering schedule on the form. It was too frequent, by the way. About 2 cups every 36 hours or sooner. I'm finding little-by-slow that there is a touch of Zen to this. I'm trying to control too many factors with too little empirical experience. I believe I'm starting to understand now. Hey, as well...thanks for not being a douche when you elementally break it down for a neophyte such as myself; I'm pretty green (bad pun, I know). Your tact is MUCHO appreciated.

MB

 

[MojoBobo]

Update - Pics

Update - Pics

Ok, so after scaling the water schedule way back, adjusting the lights a bit lower and ordering some Cal-Mag (should be here in four days), here's what she looks like as of today:


Her tips, as shown on the bottom tier, are the slightest bit crispy/brown; the brown being barely visible to the naked eye. This condition, since following instructions to withhold water, doesn't appear to be spreading. I'll let you be the judge: Any further observations? Does the original diagnosis stand? Apologies for the resolution on the pics, my cell camera is shite.

MB

 

[ibjamming]

Those pictures are classic over watering/fertilizing. You did the big mistake that every new grower does...too much...of everything. You're loving them to death.

A proper seedling has the leaves/tips pointing up like it's reaching for the light.

It's going to take a week or two to show recovery...be patient...don't do ANYTHING rash. It needs to dry out and THEN it will start to recover. I've had/seen worse recover fully...nasty looking, all yellow and brown, drooping...ended up with lots of delectable buds.

No more than a few tablespoons of water just around the stem to keep it from drying out the roots up near the top of the pot. And wait...

I reread your mix...where is the dolomite lime? It adds Ca/Mg and buffers pH. That or regular tap water should give it enough Ca/Mg...at least for now. Be careful with additives and ALWAYS go a little less not more than they recommend you use. You can always ADD more...you can't take it away. Sure, you can flush everything out and start over...but do you think that's good for the plant? Think of how you would feel if you were flushed out completely and had to start over. I'm not a believer in flushing unless a mistake is made.

Oh...and since I'm here...next time skip the jiffy pot things for starting seeds. Just use your mix (with dolomite lime at about a tablespoon per 1-2 gallons of soil) in a small beer cup with good drainage... Start the seeds in there instead of a jiffy pot. The Jiffy pots don't have anything for the plant to eat and "I" think weed does better with some food...but not a lot. Your worm castings and probably the organic soil you bought has some nutes. I don't actually "feed" with mixed nutes until the cotyledons start to turn yellow.

I used to be a baby killer...watering and fertilizing too much. I've had seedlings like yours. It took me a while to learn that hands off is oftentimes better than too much care.

My mix (works every time for me) is similar to yours... 1/3 peat moss, 1/3 mushroom compost, 1/3 perlite, along with some dolomite lime for Cal/Mag and buffering. I also use my tap water for the Cal/Mag it provides. I let it sit out for 24 hours to let some of the Chlorine evaporate...though as they get older, I usually forget and it still works fine. If you have decent water, other gardeners around you use it, then go ahead and use tap water...it's usually got trace minerals that plants like. I also add some molasses every few weeks.

Go slow and easy...be patient...wait for the plant to recover on it's own, don't add too much "shit", and you'll be smoking some bud in a few months. Be prepared for nothing much visibly to happen over the next couple of weeks as the plant heals and grows a root system. I'd guess it will be the first week of July before you really start to see growth.

The "birth" stage is the hardest to get through, at least for me. Once you pass this seedling stage and enter the rapid veg stage, it'll be clear sailing!

I usually recommend bag seed for the first grow or two. Until you get the hang of it and can successfully grow from start to finish a few times before spending big bucks on premium seeds.

And yes...there is tons of conflicting information here. The trick is to find someone growing the same way you do...and pick their brain! Look in the growers forum and look at the grow diaries...find a similar grow and ask them what they do. Otherwise, you're shooting in the dark. Organic is different than hydro, LED is different than HID, GH nutes are different than A/N nutes. Get it? What works for me (I have a whole room for growing) won't work in a PC case grow...micro growers have a whole lot of extra "things" they have to worry about that I don't. I wouldn't presume to answer a question about that type of grow. Unfortunately, some people will comment on things they have no "real world" experience with. Remember what I said earlier...some things you have to actually do with your own two hands...you can't "know it" by reading it in a book. Much of growing is trial and error...getting a "feel" for it.

Good luck...once you dial it in...you're in for some good times!

 

[simon]

Having a bit of trouble with my just 2 week old Sharksbreath. Yellowing edges on bottom growth. Not sure if its over-watering or N def.

Thought I'd post, as I'm running a test plant of the same strain. OP, you've received some excellent advice and I hope you don't mind if I add a few words. There's elegance in simplicity that leads to successful grows, especially for beginners. You're making everything needlessly complicated. Next time, plant the seeds in 16oz cups filled with Pro-Mix or a Seed Starter mix. Water when the cup feels light. Use a complete fertilizer (like Jack's Classic) and begin feeding 1/4 strength from the first watering, increasing the proportion over the course of subsequent watering. Hard to miss.

Simon

 

[NiteTiger]

IB is right. You mentioned ordering some cal-mag, why? Don't feed them right now!

Those little round leaves at the bottom are the coyts, and their specific purpose in life is to provide the seedling with the nutrients it needs in the first few weeks. For future reference, don't start giving nutes until those yellow, that's your signal to start nutes.

Otherwise, as you found out, they get burnt to a crisp.

Using this as an indicator, I've never burned my seedlings. Killed them other ways, but not by over feeding

 

[MojoBobo]

But Wha?

But Wha?

...where is the dolomite lime? It adds Ca/Mg and buffers pH. That or regular tap water should give it enough Ca/Mg...at least for now.

I'm using distilled...IBJ recommended adding a bit of the Ca/Mg to the water, am I reading this incorrectly? Clarification, please?

MB

 

[ibjamming]

What's the status? Looking any better? It takes time to recover...as long as they're not getting worse you should be OK.

 

[MojoBobo]

Looking Good!

Looking Good!

After retro-transplantation, I started realizing what everyone was trying to convey. I understand now about mj watering schedules. She is absolutely THRIVING now with that as well as the addition of the Cal-Mg to the mix. Thanks again for the helpful info IBJ, it cut a swath in a field of confusion! Much appreciated!

MB

p.s. Have a 90w UFO LED on the way...quite excited...will post results if you're interested.

 

[ibjamming]

After retro-transplantation, I started realizing what everyone was trying to convey. I understand now about mj watering schedules. She is absolutely THRIVING now with that as well as the addition of the Cal-Mg to the mix. Thanks again for the helpful info IBJ, it cut a swath in a field of confusion! Much appreciated!

MB

p.s. Have a 90w UFO LED on the way...quite excited...will post results if you're interested.

Glad to hear it recovered.

I'd love to hear about that light. I saw a 90W UFO somewhere pretty cheap, I was tempted to use it for veg. Something I can stash away anywhere that doesn't get hot. I'd like to know how hot it gets and how well it performs. I'm too lazy to look...what lights are you using now?

Good luck!

 

[MojoBobo]

Its here!

Its here!

Yeah, I was using a Longstar CFL Full Spectrum 105W (quick specs: 6200 lumens, 5000K, 1250mA) - with a Sun System Bright Wing reflector mounting. The change-over was the UFO in addition to lining four walls of the garment box with sheet mylar. I've had the UFO + Mylar setup for about two days now. Two words: MY. GOD. I check my ladies (yeah, plural - the Shark is in concert now with a Bubba Kush on the brass and a Spicy White Devil playing the back-beat) about 3-4 times daily - visable growth upon each inspection! Its akin to a home-brewed phototron now. Its ridiculous, seriously. I'm almost ashamed! Almost. I'm getting together some pics, but the predominant color of the lamp is a weird purple-red saturation, which really doesn't photograph well. I'll probably say the hell with it and post 'em anyway.

MB

 

[MojoBobo]

The Inside Story

The Inside Story

Heres one; again, my cell camera is crap. The Shark is in the foreground, then, in order, Bubba Kush (bottom center), Spicy White Devil (top right), and my wife's tomato seedling (top left). As I stated in my earlier post, the light is odd. I can't (especially since the addition of the mylar) look into the box for too long without it playing with my eyes. Think of the negative post-image after looking into the sun briefly... Thanks for the interest - I'll keep posting in this thread hopefully until harvest, which by the looks of it, may be sooner than I thought.

MB

p.s. As to your heat question: With the 3 internal fans (they can be replaced independently, by the way, if one or more should ever fail) the unit produces almost no appreciable heat; as well, should ambient temperatures exceed "normal" levels , the unit has an auto-power off feature. Nice, huh?

MB

 

[moonie]

Looks alot better, my only concern would be that tomato plant. Damn those things seem to be bug magnets

 

[MojoBobo]

Yeah, its only in there for its first week to give it a head-start, but duly noted. Thanks moonie, hadn't really considered that.

MB