Stealth Mother Box Build, Please Comment

Hey IC,



I Wanted to turn this old set of Ikea type draws into a chamber for bonsai mothers. Its inside dimensions are 30x23x15 heightxwidthxdepth. I was hoping that all i would have to do is put a front and back on it, as it already has a bottom, top and two sides.

And then put this 60w florescent light in it. Let me know if this light is good for what i'm trying to do?



its a spare light for the cloning chamber in the cab I bought. (I know you do-it-yourselfers frown upon buying a grow box, but i'm not good at building shit, so please forgive me) Anyway, as far as lighting goes, the mothers dont have to grow super fast, as I only plan on using clones from them once a year. (will need 14 clones per run, so probably take 20 cuttings off it once a year)

I want to have 4 in there. Do you think that is enough space for 4 bonsai's?

I was just gong to use particle board or plywood for the front and backs, as far as the stealth factor, i wanted to just glue the drawer faces to the front panel, but I am missing one drawer. This set of drawers was already in my place when I moved in, its under a homemade workbench the previous owner appears to have built.

Do you think i could get a 30 inch drawer like that at home depot or something to replace the one that is missing?

Also, do you think I need mylar or tinfoil for the inside? The inside of the drawer box are already that white veneer that comes on most white ikea furniture, I was hoping i could just spraypaint the sides I add flat white. Would this suffice?

Also, i was going to seal the cracks with caulk, and put duct tape over the peg-holes for the drawers or shelves or whatever was intended to go in there. And obviously I can just remove the tracks for the drawers by taking the screws out.

Do you think a mother box like this needs ventilation? like a PC fan or something, or is it cool for it to be air tight? I assume I need some degree of ventilation but please confirm?

Also, its in the basement so its a little cool down there, probably between 60 and 65 degrees, will that be an issue? again, they dont have to grow fast, i'm just trying to maintain my genetics.

Any input is GREATLY appreciated.

thanks to anyone who has taken the time to read this. Sorry the pictures are small, I dont have a camera so I had to use my camera phone.

This is my first time uploading pics, so if it doesnt work they are in the gallery.

Your going to want ventilation, since the ambient temperature is low you probably don't need a ton of ventilation for cooling but your going to want the air to exchange. Mylar on the inside is best or I've seen people use safety blankets from wal-mart in substitute for mylar. I'm pretty sure tinfoil isn't a good idea, could be wrong but I don't ever see it used to line the walls. For your box and since the room temp is good I'd put the fan near the top left corner to pull out the warmer air and pull the cool air in threw a passive intake in the bottom. Many people use like a plumbing 90 degree turn pipe, 2 of them put together and painted black inside prevents light from escaping but then again you'll end up with a tube hanging out the side unless you mount it entirely inside the box. The best option is dark room louvers for light proofing by far if thats even an issue.

Also are you sure that little bulb is 60w? Either way a small bulb like that will probably be just fine for maintaining a mother and getting clones going. If you have temp problems (too low for whatever reason) you could use CFLs also, I use 3 of them for 130w in my veg box and it gets pretty warm inside of there (I can keep it down to about 8degrees above ambient with 3 fans and 3 passive intakes).

yes, 4 bonsai moms should fit in there just fine.
yes, flat white paint will work great.
yes, you will need some ventilation ; a pc fan up high and an intake hole down low should do it.
you should be able to get a piece of white melmaline shelving from home depot that you can cut to size to replace the missing drawer front. since the box will (presumeably) stay under the workbench it doesnt need to look original, right ?
as for temps, a small light in a small box should raise your temps several degrees above ambient, so temps are likely to be just fine.

happy growing !

Cool, thanks so much for the quick responses. I went to home depot and they do indeed sell those white vinyl drawers, so i'm cool on that.

RJE, it says 60 watt on the packaging, does that seem high or low? Will that be enough? what light setup would you suggest instead? I can get another one of those ones that i already have, or i could get some of those spirally florescents from home depot, just let me know what you think will work best.

Funny story actually, while i was at home depot checking those spirally light bulbs out, some dude came up behind me and asked "what type of project are you working on today?" kinda creeped me out, i said "none" and walked out of the store, as i was already on my way out and those bulbs caught my attention on my way to the exit. Dunno if i'm just being wierd or if it looked suspicious or something. Is there some kind of connotation with those types of light bulbs or something?

Green Grow, no it doesn't need to look original.

I guess what i'm gunna do is get some 1/4inch plywood, cut it to size for the back wall, paint it flat white, drill a hole in it with a circular saw for a PC fan and one for a passie intake, that I will cover with cheese cloth (or something else if anyone car recomend something) to curb the amount of dust or other crap that will get in there. Cut another piece of plywood for the front, use hinges mounted on the inside so that i can open the front as a door, and use a magnet (unless someone can suggest something better) to hold the door shut. Then use liquid nails or something to glue the drawer faces on the front of the door.

My only question at this point is if that 60w florescent light that I showed in the picture is my best option? should i get a second one of them? or should I get those spirally florescent that i got caught checking out at home depot?

Also, that white veneer shit that the cabinet is made out of is reflective enough that i dont have to paint over it with flat white paint, right?

Also, 60 degree temps won't do any harm right? its just not Ideal?

Also, whats a good soil mix for moms? I was planning on useing this natural potting soil/peat/compost shit that i have, and mix it with perlite. Sound good? let me know if there is something else I should get instead?

Thanks again for your help guys. Appreciate it.

Edit:


RJE...

That light is 60w output, uses 15 watts of energy, I'd appreciate you (or anyone else) letting me know if that going to be enough, or if i should get a second one of them, or just use the spirally florecents, if so, how many of them and many watts each?

I'd prefer to not use the spirally ones, but will if i'm told they are much better.

The fan i'm planning on using is 115 CFM. Does that sound good?

also, instead of the cheese cloth i was thinking a thin layer of that sponge foam shit that mattress pads are made out of, but where do i get that shit?

Also, the mothers shouldn't smell? will they? since they aren't flowering?

Again, I appreciate all the help, I'd be lost without it.

the 60watts is actually 60 watts EQUIVALENT when compared to incandescent, however, for growing purposes we use the lower figure . 15 watts is pretty small, but i will defer to more experienced bonzai growers as to whether it will be enough to keep moms healthy in a box that size. spiral flourescents (commonly called compact flourescents , cfl for short) work great. not sure how well air will pass through sponge, i would go with cheesecloth or womens nylons instead. you soil mix sounds just fine.
smell is strain-dependent. my little mother/veg./clone cab. doesnt smell, even when i am standing in front of it with the doors open.

p.s. : rather than panic and bolt out of the store, try to have a plausible explanantion for what you are doing, as clerks are SUPPOSED to approach you and offer assistance. for example, when staring at the endless array of lights you might say that you have never used cfls in your home before and are just scopeing out the selection.

Yeah, I agree that it would have been better to have a story and not just ran away, this dude wasn't a store employee though. Just some 35ish looking guy. Then again, people around here are known for being extra friendly, and I just moved here from near NYC, and we are known for being real short and rude with strangers. If anything I think I came off as just not wanting to chat with him, and not like I was scared/nervous, which was pretty much the reality of the situation. I dunno, still a little weird though IMO. Probably just my imagnination

Women's nylons are a great idea, thats what I'll do.

Any Idea about the lights then? 30 watts (two 15's) probably wouldn't be enough either than I am guessing. Someone let me know though if I am wrong.

I think what I'm going to do is get one of these CFL grow bulbs that I found online. My Question now is 125w, 150W or 200W? I dont know if would be better to go with one of the higher wattage ones to limit the plants reaching for the the light source and stretching out? Or if I want a less powerful one that will cause it to grow slower. What i'm asking here is which should give me the least space between nodes? Someone let me know please?

Also, for anyone who has made a CFL setup before, what do I need for a socket? Do they make one that is just a small socket with a plug coming out of the back? Or do I have to get one of the ones with the blue box attached to it? Do I need to get a specific wattage socket?

If So... With these CFL bulbs, is the wattage its labeled, Say the 125, does that mean equal to 125 incandescent? Or that it operates on 125w of current? Or does it even matter and i can just put any wattage CFL in any light socket without repercussion?

Also, I realized that if I put the hinges on the inside like i said, than i won't be able to open it, so i'm going to have to figure out a way to have it so that I can just take the whole front panel off. Thats easy though, what I'm trying to figure out is how to hold it in place while its shut. I'll have to cruise the cabinet aisle and see what's available. If anyone has any ideas on that, feel free to share em. I want it to shut tight though so that light doesn't leak out the front.

Thanks for the help

i really wouldnt bother with one of those big, fancy "grow lights" that you see on-line when cfls can be bought almost anywhere and do a GREAT job for moms, cuttings, and vegging. in fact, many people use them throughout the entire grow, with good results.
i say go with maybe 4 x 23w cfl in your space . keep the tops of the plants close to the lights and stretching for light will not be an issue at all. you dont want much more power than that because you want to keep the growth slow, right ? regardless, cfls are cheap and you can just buy higher/lower wattages as needed. go with "cool white" or "daylight" for moms. the "warm white" is more suited to flowering.
yes, you can get the adaptors you have described with the plug coming out the back. in fact, you could get 4 of those and plug them directly into a power strip, for a quick, easy, plug-and-play set-up.

green_grow said:

i really wouldnt bother with one of those big, fancy "grow lights" that you see on-line when cfls can be bought almost anywhere and do a GREAT job for moms, cuttings, and vegging. in fact, many people use them throughout the entire grow, with good results.
i say go with maybe 4 x 23w cfl in your space . keep the tops of the plants close to the lights and stretching for light will not be an issue at all. you dont want much more power than that because you want to keep the growth slow, right ? regardless, cfls are cheap and you can just buy higher/lower wattages as needed. go with "cool white" or "daylight" for moms. the "warm white" is more suited to flowering.
yes, you can get the adaptors you have described with the plug coming out the back. in fact, you could get 4 of those and plug them directly into a power strip, for a quick, easy, plug-and-play set-up.

Click to expand...

Cool GG,

Thanks so much for taking the time to read my posts and holding my hand through this. Now you probably see why I didn't try to build my own cab, had to ask a million questions before simply putting a lightbulb in a box. haha. Anyway, there is nothing left to do now but to just go ahead and do it. I'll post pics as I make any progress, but I woun't need this thing for a while and am sorta busy, So may be a few weeks.

Do you think I could use 2x45w cfl's instead of 4x23, or is 4x23's better? I was just thinking for less wires.

I'll give you +Rep once I have enough posts. I assume its only 50?

i was thinking 4 x 23 for better light distribution, but i am also a BIG fan of keeping things simple, so i wouldnt hesitate to go 2 x 45 watts.

Which is better, cool white or daylight? or doesn't it matter?

a few 26 watt energy saving lightbulbs(CFLs)_ will do ur job a treat in there.... Id iuse normal ceiling pedant fittings from them andadjust the height by putting a loop in the cable and holding it with a twist tie-not acceptable for a proper growlight but a little household CFL isnt going to be an issue....oh, get screw fitting CFLs not Bayonet fittings,screws are more secure where the bayonet ones tend to wobble in the fitting

Cool, thanks for the feedback

Cool White or Daylight? or doesn't it matter?

either would do...or mix em....

I was just gunna get a 4 pack, i guess i'll just grab one or the other, unless anyone can say one is better than the other.

Okay, I got the soft white, is that correct for Veg?

Also, I started Construction, So far kinda shotty, not pretty but it will work. Not so good with the carpentry skills. I think I'm going to bring the front panel to HD to have them cut it for me, since they have a table saw and I used a jigsaw on the back and didn't get it strait. But I was just going to ducktape the cracks around the edges to make it air/light tight. I know ducktape is sort of transluscent, but it shouldn't matter because its the back, and is facing the wall. Also, i have aluminum tape unless its suggested not to use reflective tape because it will make hot spots.

The part I'm really worried about is the front panel, mounting the hinges, and gluing the drawer faces on to it, because this is the only part that has to look pretty so it doesn't look sketchy.

Also, i was thinking about using this instead as a CFL grow box instead of for mothers. I would have to start from seeds everytime, but they are so cheap on SB that its not a problem. And i'm not real great at growing anyway, so its not like I have a prized phenotype or anything. I suppose I can always change back and use it for mothers too if I get a pheno I like. Anyway, i'll take some shitty cameraphone pictures of my shitty job as soon as I get enough shitty work done to show some shitty progress. Thanks for the help, and keep it coming.

Also, Looking for Ideas to stop light leaks from around the sides of the door. Was thinking of using that weather stripping stuff that people put around air Conditioner window units. The piece of plywood i am gunna use for the front door is slightly warped, I have some weights sitting on it right now trying to flatten it out, dont know if it will work. Let me know if you can help.

Illadelph,
First off, you have to realize that you are way ahead of many folks in that you are even attempting to DIY. Many won't even take the plunge, and end up spending mucho coin for what ever they do. Which is fine too...
But give yourself some credit for wanting to attempt these things. You will grow in knowledge from the hands on experience. And there are plenty of good folks here that will help you out all they can.

The soft white CFL's will do fine. Later on you may want to experiment with other colors, such as a bright white, which may give you tighter internodes, but the lights you chose will provide a quite adequate spectrum.

I try to stay away from duct tape as much as possible. Some things it only makes sense to use it, but if you can use aluminum tape, do so. Try to find a big roll for cheap. They are hard to find but they do exist. It is one of the biggest ripoff items we use, IMO.
The hotspot stuff is bunk for the most part, IMO. It won't even come into play unless you have high intensity lamps say over 400watts. And even then.....I think that is a warning lots like to give for lack of anything else to offer.

Yes, weatherstrip is your friend. Self adhesive types in the 3/4" size are best, IMO.
I like to use the closed cell auto grade stuff (Home De Pot) but any will do the trick.
The window stuff tends to get soft in time I think. Be creative with it.

I like caulking too. But many don't. You can get a single tube of self propelled stuff from Home De Pot that will probably seal up the edges of all your cab.
If you have big cracks, expansion foam in the medium grade can help, but be very careful as a little will expand ALOT. It can even break apart things you have nailed together. I would cover up anything I used it on with aluminum tape though, as I am not sure about the fumes it puts off.

Hope I was of some help.

Cool, thanks for the help and encouragement. Is duct tape bad?

You know anything about DWC? I got a grow going on right now that I think might be about to turn south. Here is my infermary post

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=90206

also, HD has soft white, bright white and daylight CFL's, which is best for veg and which is best for flower, because i can still return them.

Duct tape is great if you ask me, unless used to cover wires because it has metal in it. Warm White cfls works best for flower. As for your dwc setup, have you tested the ph of the water your using? Are you feeding them any nutrients? Do you use a netpot with a medium?

what is warm white? Same as soft white? PH is around 6 i think. I have an aquarium testing kit with the drops, and the water is allready a little/yellow green from the nutes, so its hard to tell exactly, 700 PPMs. 3" netpot, hydoton. Let me know if you can help, and thanks for your time and interest

Okay, Got the back wall painted, mounted exhaust fan and 90 degree black elbo for passive intake. Installed the back wall, and am caulking around the edges to seal the cracks. I'll have to get some more caulk because I ran out before I finished, In the top left corner the gap is about an inch, so... lots of caulk.

Not muchleft to do, just install the light fixture and the front.

I was thinking about scrapping the idea of the plywood for the front, because it is warped. I was thinking maybe I could just fasten all the drawer faces together and find some way to hinge that too the rest of the box. The problem with anything for the front is that pretty much every side of the box is warped because it is that shitty particle board laminated shit. If anyone has any suggestions for the front, please throw em on out. I was thinking of hinging it on the bottom, and opening it like a dishwasher opens, that way the hinges are out of site, but how do I get it to stay closed? I was thinking using these magnet things that are often on Entertainment centers/tv cabinets. Its just so hard for me to put anything together because i have a hard time putting things exactly where they are supposed to go. But again, I appriciate all the help so far, so keep it coming. The way i look at it, there are no bad suggestions, some are just better than others. (will post Pics of progress in a few)