Femora goes strainhunting in Coco-DTW!

Heya folks!

Im back at the vert-section after a looong outdoor-adventure with AFs@Lat 65.
Its been a rough time with alot of fun, but now its snow here within a month so its time to turn the focus indoor.

This time I'm going 5 plants each, in a 600W flipflop. The growroom is thesame; if ya cant remember, its a ~1,2kW powerrestriction to a stonebunker with only 0,5-1,5meters of sand around/over it for isolation.
There is no waste, so I have to use buckets or similar to get rid of any leftovers.


The plan is as following;
7-8 liter mix of Coco/Perlite 50/50 in 10 liter plastic buckets with a few 10mm drainholes.
Greenhouse powerfeeding (15+7+22+(3.6) ) @ EC 0,8-1,0
Drain To Waste (this means ill gather the runoff in a 80l plastic container, and carry the shit out whenever needed)

Airflow is a issue since I wont be able to take outdoor air all the time (-30C is plausible...)
But the temps should be okay cus I circulate the on-room to the off-room, and I will add a tempreglated ventfan to pull air out from the bunker when/if its gettin hot in there.
Its been working during the summer, so I doubt HIGH temps will be an issue. And low temps shouldent bee THAT much offside when I have 600W continuously in there..

Issues? Oh yes. Already!
I reused my coco/perlite, and even after a good flush sending EC down to 0,05 (as the water in), I still have a really low pH on the runoff.
At 5.8 the runoff is about 4.1
At 6.3 its up to 4.4

The mix was not flushed enough (at all? ) when my growbuddy set the seedlings into the medium and it resulted with 10/12 dead plants, and the last 2 were looking really really bad for quite some time.

I did a proper flush, set a new batch of seeds in paper and waited..

What strains are going on in there?
Dinafem
Cheese
Critical+
And 8 of Da Bean Co freebies.


So; here is a a plant from 25 days ago:




Ill followup in the next posts with pics of each plant.



Wish me luck..!

Stay safe!
Fem~

Plants

Plants

So; Since I have those freebies, and 2 I know off I will name the plants by number instead of strainname...

(The #1 is the Crit+, #10 is the Cheese)

I now notice that #5 is missing from my gallery.. I have to fix that asap.

So; They will be flipped tonight, and the autofeed-system will be setup once again.
Ya, this means Ive handwatered them until now. Every second day or so since transplant from cups.
It was more convenient to do it like this to monitor runoff.. Atleast it felt better.
And I have to buy another bucket for the Drain I just remember.. Or fix that 200L barrel with diesel I have standing in the garage -.-


The plants is between 27-42 cm high, and 15-37 cm wide.
I rather flower em small when I dunno how the heck they will stretch...



Here we go!

#1 Critical+


#2



#3



#4



#5

Plants

Plants

Continue;


The droopyness; Is that pH or overwater-related?



#6





#7





#8





#9




#10 Cheese



Welcome to the show. Hope you'll enjoy it!

Stay Safe!
Fem~

First seat

Looks like DTW coco is catching on... more and more people don't it.

tuned in

Femora said:

Continue;


The droopyness; Is that pH or overwater-related?

Click to expand...

Didnt read how often you were feeding. Those plants are big and established in their pots, its almost certainly not overwatering...

Looks like a PH issue. I have a Girl Scout Cookie Mom that I watered with water that was too low due to calibration issue w/ my meter. two days later, looked exactly like your plants. fix ph, you'll be fine.

#7, #8 appear most affected by ph.

Welcome onboard, fellas!


Ive updated the posts with pics of #5 and #10.




pH-issues.. aye..
But I dunno how to fight it, really..

I provide all info I have on the issue, and I'd really appreciate a solution. Or ideas to sort out where I messed up.

My Hanna combo was calibrated just a few weeks ago.

I had severe pH-issues last run when I did a recirc system. I really couldnt imagine how BIG the problems would be.
The medium is re-used and flushed ALOT. The water in and out was just like 10-12 ppm difference when I was done.
Im watering at EC 0.8, runoff is 0.7
Ph 6.3-6.4 in, 4.2-4.3 out.

Whats going on?

Between the runs some buckets dried up, other were still moisty when I prepared to reuse the media..
I know that once coco/perlite dries up it might give pH-fluctations.. But I have no idea how to counter it, or what the reason is for putting the pH off when drying up.
Is there some fungus going on that bring havoc to the pH? Old rootmass still in there thats spooking?
I dunno where to start looking for solutions..

Cannazym or similar.. Would that do any difference? If its fungus; can I use h2o2-solution to flush it out?

Feeding will from tomorrow be on drip 3-4x/day




I recon next run will be with new medium. Cant take more of this shit...


btw, I was looking at the last grow where I vegged under LE, and this round of HPS-vegged ladies..Well.. The pics speak for themself!
Compare em to any of the pics above, LOL!




Stay safe!



Edit; yeah, there is a few plants that look more affected the the others.. It gotta be straindependent since they get thesame nutes(?) Afaik it could be 10 different strains in there.

I agree with dabs, looks like a ph issue. My advice would be to make up a batch of nutes at normal feed levels, but don't add ph down, or if needed, add ph up until your nutes are 7+ ph. Pour this solution on each plant at a rate of about a half gal. every 10 mins. Continue this process until the runoff ph is back in the desired range. You are probably looking at 5-10 gals of flush for each plant, possibly more, possibly less.

It is good practice to calibrate your ph/ppm pens weekly

A long post...

A long post...

I had a little chat with mr D and sorted some confusion out.. and I've flushed the plants with ~250 liters of nutes with EC 1.0-1.2 @ pH 7.0-7.4

I cannot blend more then 70 liter nutes at the time, and I had to use a mix of the green house power feeding and a local supermarket vegnutes to get the pH up..
This is why the ec and ph werent constant..
btw, the runoff at the worst plant (#7) was at pH 3.8 (!!!)


However; the flush got the runoff up to 5.4-5.9 for all plants.
I hope this will do to fix those clawing leafs.
Im going back to EC 0.9 at pH 6 with only greenhouse powerfeeding now.

I have 2 different nutes from GH;
N-P-K-Mg: 18+12+18+(1.2)
This one has
10% NS Nitrogen Nitrate
8% NA Nitrogen Ammoniacal
OR
N-P-K-Mg: 15+7+22+(3.6)
10% NS Nitrogen Nitrate
5% NA Nitrogen Ammoniacal

^^^clickable links to GHs homepage, or just google "powderfeeding" if ure paranoid but still curious

which one should I use to keep the pH stabile?
I figure as the plant seem to like the ammonical N since I get the pH down, and should therefor use the later of the two nutes I linked.
Or am I mindf-cking myself here?
On the other hand; If its fungus that keep the pH down.. Im just ranting...


There is not much to show at the grow.. The stretch is taking off, and the plantsizes differ ALOT..
Off to the next subject;



Tonight I will take cuts from the Jorge Diamonds I kept as a mom from the last run.. This was some dense nugs, and the best yielder of the 4 strains I ran in low-ph-conditions.
If I have thesame shitty pH, same size plant I should end up at 0,75 gpw. If I can keep a decent pH and I hope to reach up to 0.9.. minimum!



And for this I need some advice.. I will change location and this means I will have a bigger space 2,8x5x2,4m~ (9"x15"x8"), more power, incomming water, but still no drain. 2,4 kW flower is what Im aiming at, I cant get rid of that much weed as I see it now.. And I do not want to stash kilos IF I get caught.

I haven't decided how to set it up and I would love some advice/ideas.
I still wanna use coco and dripfeed DTW, pump the waste out manually. (a hydro bobblerack would probably rock my socks, but im to much of a novice to hit that game... yet!

Ive been playing with the thought of a 2-level donut, 2 stacked 600W.
2 rooms, identical setup.
To set this up I'd use the wall to fix half the grow, and build a "shelf" on wheels so I can move out halv the grow to get in and work there.

The other ideas thats crossed my mind is a Marlo-setup with a longer room with 2x600w aside, and fill up the walls, x2 setups.
this would cut down my amount of space in the room, but it would still fit in..

So, do you have any ideas for me? Feedback? Thoughts?
I'd love to hear it all!

Stay safe!
Fem~

it seems like your medium isnt acting as a buffer whatsoever. I agree with the high ph flush to an extent; have you tried testing the ph of the COCO itself using another method besides just testing the runoff?

Question; why is it so hard for you to get the PH right? You're running DTW, it should be ALOT easier than hydro/recirculating, etc.

I think its remainings of my last round.. This medium is re-used, and last round did I try a recirc setup and got severe issues with the pH.

I thought a MAJOR flush would be enough, ut I was probably misstaken.
I will toss all old media out when I start up my next round.


No, I have not tried the pH of the media. Ive spoken with mr D and I will do it asap.

Femora said:

I think its remainings of my last round.. This medium is re-used, and last round did I try a recirc setup and got severe issues with the pH.

I thought a MAJOR flush would be enough, ut I was probably misstaken.
I will toss all old media out when I start up my next round.


No, I have not tried the pH of the media. Ive spoken with mr D and I will do it asap.

Click to expand...

After thinking about dabs last comment a bit, and our conversations, I'm more inclined to believe it's your nutes that are driving ph out of range. Coco and perlite are both very easy to flush for reuse when using chem nutes. Just running dtw would normally be enough to keep things in line, because constant ph and ec from the res do an excellent job of regulating the two. You mentioned in pm that your nutes alone drop you ph into the low 6's. I'm thinking they were designed for hard water and/or heavy clay soil. As a result they would contain acidic buffers that drive your media's ph down over time. Explains your healthy plants early on with steady decline as time goes on. Check your media ph like we discussed, and let me know. Think it's time to find a new nutrient. Look for something with a high nitrate nitrogen content. Ideally no more than 2% ammoniacal nitrogen. See what's available to you and write down the guaranteed analysis for each. Post or pm them to me, and i'll see what I can come up with for a coco friendly schedule for you. I'll need N,P,K, CA, MG, off the label.

Whats new on day 14?

yeah, the stores I visited had either no destilled water, or it was sold out. The chase for the media-pH continues...

Ive decided to change nutes to GHE after some private-messaging with mr D


The plants seem to be doing better after the flush.. So thats some progress.

But there was a BIG step in the wrong direction.
I never noticed that the freebies was regular seeds. So I felt utterly confused when I been away 4-5 days and come back and find ballsacks on 4 of the 10 plants!!
Nothing to do but to take the axe and chop them down.

There was not a single ballsack that had opened up, so thats something to smile at in all the misery..

I guess I better just put that shit behind me and add it to the "learningcurve"..



The automatic feed has been set up and is working just fine..

I guess I should get some pics up to make it more interesting.. Hmm..
In a while, aye.


For some reason did I leave some old cuts from previous runs, so I have 4 plants to fill in the 4 spots. Its nothing close to the others, but since I dunno the flowertime of the strains im running now I might aswell add this 8-8,5 week ladies..


Stay safe!
Fem~

Looking forward to seeing the set up. I need some ideas for my next round. You can use some RO water, not Aquafina because it does have minerals added but basic RO water for checking media pH. If you're not learning something new then your not becoming a better gardener. I learn or re-learn stuff quite a bit.

I just came from the growbunker and Im pleased with how it works out... oddly enough..


Im still having pH-issues in most of the buckets. The pH-runoff dropped to 4.8-5 in all but one bucket.. And in that last bucket the runoff comes out at 5.8! (6.3 feed)
What the heck is going on?


They look droopy.. oh yes.. And the items I ordered hasn´t arrived yet.



@Zen Medz

You asked me about the growroom, aye, It is a bad one... I have really, really shitty conditions where Im growing.

Check out https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=259365 if youre curious about how bad it really is.. <grin>


My-layout can be seen in the link, and each flowerroom looks like this;





In the back there is chicken-net used to scrog 3 plants in Marlo-style!
The 2 in the front is just 2 sticks in the media and then some chicken-net attached to allow training outside the sticks


I have no drain, and the ceiling is just 175-180 cm from the floor..
So I made a table, 2 parts, leaning inward and covered it in building-plastic and made a hole in the middle . Thats my "drain", dripping to a 80 liter plastic container. From there I have to carry it outdoor in buckets whenever its about to get full.
The feeding is a timered waterpump and it seems like 1 min feed with that pump with 5 plants is okay. Atm I get about 0,1 liter runoff from every watering. I expect it to be 0 runoff in a week or so, and then I just turn up a 2 min pulse at 1 of the 3 feeds they get per day.





---------------------------------

As I previously posted; I had 4 males in there(!!)
None were to release pollen, but I got 4 slots open in the flowerrooms.
For some strange reason.. probably sentimental.. hadn't I thrown all cuts away from previous plants/possible keepers.. They were in 0,5 liter coco, just... looking miserable in the vegbox under 3x36w T8 together with a Jorges Diamons mother and 30~ cuts..


This is what the Brainstorm cut looked like;


And this is something the label had runned away from; I suspect it to be Euforia..




If you just knew how little care I given these ladies.. They have dried up, fell aside multiple times, been in transparent cups, underfed, overfed...
Im a lil' ashmed to think about how I treated em..

Anyway; Now its their time to shine!
They are set up to be the two frontbuckets in each room.
The original plants in that position were untied and put to the "wall" in the back.


I got a problem with the veg in the other direction with the other plants.. They have been vegged around a 600W hps. This gave a internodal distance that was <SICK> on some of the plants.
Tightest was 14 nodes in 40cm at the day introducing flower. Thats almost a node per inch, overall.
At the tightest place there was 4 nodes in 3 cm (1,25 inch)

So, at a few plants I have been forced to cut away a few branches to even make them fit the net.. I didnt see THAT problem commin' when I started this round..
Its almost like the supercropped Euforia that went crazy in the net and I got some mold-issues..


Here is #1 Critical +



I kept some numbers on their size from the day 1 of flower, and I remeasured them today..
Numbers in CM... Divide with 2,5 to convert to inches.. Hihi!
Day 1; 9 Nodes
W: 40 H: 34
Day 19;
W: 68 H: 68


Here is #4



Day 1; 12 Nodes
W: 35 H: 30
Day 19;
W: 60 H: 57

Continue in next post...

And so we go again!


Here is #8 @Day19



Day 1; 8 Nodes
W: 27 H: 40
Day 19;
W: 65 H: 75



Here is #7 @Day19



Day 1; 11 Nodes
W: 27 H: 40
Day 19;
W: 55 H: 60

She is not fond of the pH-issues.. not at all.. And I given them a small flush today with nutes at EC 0.9 and pH 7.3 to get em back in business (hopefully)..
Pic is a good example of how I used some of the branches that would be "to much" at the wall and train it forward instead. They will be about 45 degrees "under" the lightbulb. But I figure its better to use the lumens that way when I have a branch for it, rather then cut it and send the lumens into the plastic/wooden floor.

She is fastest in the room, the #10 Cheese is not far behind tho!

Here is a blurry closeup of #7!



And here is #10 Cheese!



Day 1; 12 Nodes
W: 22 H: 40
Day 19;
W: 55 H: 75


And finally; #3



She is a really chubby thing.. And as you might notice she dosen't seem to have any pH-issues(!!) Aye, this is the plant with a good 5,8 runoff.. Ideas on what the #()&/("% is going on? Fungus in the other buckets? Aliens messing with me?! (Alien Dawg!? <grin> ) Something basic I just totally oversee!?

Day 1; 10 Nodes
W: 30 H: 30
Day 19;
W: 45 H: 50


----------------------------------

I really dunno if anyone would be interested in those numbers.. I have it as a online-journal of information anyways. Allows me to destroy the note I have written it at. And another trace is removed.. Heheh...


So; I really have to get those other nutes and hopefully get the pH inrange..
I have to think about how I wanna build my next room. Its probably 2x 600w stacked, 2 setups, vertscrogg, 400w vert-veg.. Some suitable strain from this round...


Food for thought, oh yes!


Stay safe!
Fem~

Heya!

This grow is about to be done..
It feels like kind of a failure, looking at the grow from IC-eyes.

I totally lost my interest of updating the thread when I cant even upload decent pics cus of taking em with a old phone..
And there has been so many fuckups..


@ Mister D, Ive changed nutes, and the pH runoff makes my head hurt. some buckets are good, others are still and/or again down to pH4.
The destilled water-media-pH-testing gave same results, but then a week later a bad bucket was okay, and 2 good gone bad.

Im gonna toss all this shit out.. change location and make a new start.



However, to get some sort of update on the thread;

The grow turned out surprisingly interesting anyway.

Day 38, all pics

#1(Critical+);

Alot of leafs in them buds.. And all inner nuggage is just small marbles. :/




and a closeup





#4




#8

After a slow and badlooking start she got interesting since last 2 weeks.. The nugs are swelling and they are rockhard. Ill keep a cut, but I dont know if I'll acctually use her.
Her swellage sideways is far from impressing.. But that could be countered with higher plantcount. And them branches could take heavy training.