eeeeeeww, nasty!

Can anyone help me identify whats going on with these?

Unsure if its a pest problem or a nute problem, tried rubbing the black "shit" off those leaves with a baby wipe after I took the pics, but it seems to be part of the leaf rather than something pooped onto the top

The yellow veins also make me think its a nute issue, but which, i havnt a scooby











Whatever it is, it doesnt seem widespread at the moment, so hoping you can help me sort it before it becomes a real problem




SOIL:
How long has this problem been going on?
only noticed it in the past few days
What STRAIN are you growing?
Fast Nevilles Haze, Female seeds
What was the establishing technique? (seed or clone?)
seed
What is the age of your plants?
11 weeks
How long have they been in the soil mixture they are in now?
7 weeks
Were they in the same mixture when they were seedlings/smaller plant? If not, what mixture were they in before?
no, Westlands seed & cutting compost previously
How Tall are the plants?
18" roughly
What PHASE (seedling, vegetative or flower) are the plants in?
week 3 of bloom
What Technique are you using? (SOG, SCROG etc)
scrog
What size pots are you using? (Include how many subjects to pot)
11 litre pots, 1 plant each
What substrate/medium are you using? What brand of soil mixture are you using?(percentage of perlite, vermiculite...etc?)
"Westlands with added John Innes no2" and perlite. roughly 3-1
What brand Nutrient's are you using?
Canna Bio
How much of each nutrient are you using with how much water?
mixing up 3 2-litre bottles with 4ml of Bio Flores, 2ml of Maxicrop seaweed(liquid) and 2 flat teaspoons of rapadura sugar in each bottle
How often are you feeding?
every watering (low NPK content in Canna bio)
If flowering, when did you switch over to using Bloom nutrients?
fed 50/50 bloom/veg nutes for first 2 weeks
What order are you mixing your nutrients? (example: veg nutes 1st, bloom 2nd ect)
sugar - bio flores - maxicrop
What is the TDS/EC/PPM of your nutrients used?
unknown
What is the pH of the "RUN-OFF"?
6.5
How often are you testing pH/ppm/EC/TDS?
ph every watering
What method of pH test was administered? Using Strips? pH pen?
GH drops
How often are you watering?
approx every 3rd day
When was your last feeding and how often are you feeding?
yesterday, every water
What size bulb are you using?
250w hps
How old is your bulbs?
brand new (2 weeks?)
What is the distance to the canopy?
18"
What is your RH Factor? (Relative Humidity)
unknown
What is the canopy temperature?
80*F
What is the Day/Night Temp? (Include fluctuation range)
maybe about 65*F ?, cant get in to look with the lights off
What is the current Air Flow? (cfm etc.)
unknown,
Tell us about your ventilation, intake exhaust and when its
running and not running ?
fan always on, recent mods to ducting, passive intake and light trap have taken it from dubious up to satisfactory (in my eyes)
Is the fan blowing directly at plants?
no
Is the grow substrate constantly wet or moist?
not visibly, watering using lift method
Is your water HARD or SOFT?
VERY HARD
What water are you using? Reverse Osmosis (RO)? Tap? Bottled? Well water? Distilled? Mineral Water?
tap
If using tap water, what is the ppm/EC/TDS of the water right out of the tap?(Only if you have a tds pen)
-
If using RO,Distilled,mineral water, what is the ppm/EC/TDS without any additives?(Only if you have a tds pen)
-
Are you using water from a water softener?
no
Has plant been recently pruned, cloned or pinched?
pruned and some bud site removal
Have any pest chemicals been used? If so what and when?
no
Are plant's infected with pest's?
not that I can see



thanks in advance

I would say that's damn near definitely a phosphorous deficiency. You can also see the petiole is a reddish color, another classic diagnostic.

Also, you say that these plants are in veg, and I think you didn't mean that. They look to be about a month into flower, roughly, to me. And for flowering, cannabis does need a higher level of phosphorous.

Use these charts, one a graphic and the other a flow, and see if you disagree with the assessment.

it that guide were a book of the bible, it would be the Psalms. Or maybe the Acts of the Apostles. Everyone should check that out and know it by heart.

oh, and def a Phosphorous def, in my opinion.

Cool, what do you think the best course of action would be as I'm already feeding full strength every watering already?

Was thinking maybe go get some canna pk 13/14, that should work right?

It should, yes, especially if it's made from better quality ingredients. Liquid Koolbloom will also work and IIRC is 0-10-10. I usually start giving P/K boosters (on my indoor coir plants) around day 10 after the flip.

It's important for new growers to understand that charts are not, cannot really be followed like a religion, which only requires faith to work, not chemical reactions. EVERYTHING has an effect on how, and whether or not, the plant is able to utilize the nutrients given to it. Temperature, pH, humidity (as it relates to vapor pressure deficit, and it does), the forms of nutrients, and last, but hardly least, the particular plant(s) themselves. Each strain is different, and the more you grow the more you'll learn that they can be VASTLY different in their needs.

I'll give you an example: A Cali O x Blueberry that I happen to like, vs The White. With The White, you had better be giving PLENTY of Ca (most folks think it's Ca + Mg, but she's really a Ca whore once you separate the elements and watch what happens) or she's going to do nothing but bitch the entire grow. That makes sense inasmuch as Ca is an immobile element, yes? Does to me. Anyway, the COxBb line needs about half as much Ca, and less than half the N & K.

Therefore, I have to mix separate feeds if I'm running them at the same time.

It's also important to remember that by allowing pH to range that you're allowing the plant its best opportunity to utilize the available nutrients.

HTH.

Bought some canna pk13/14 yesterday and added 2 ml to each bottle of previously mentioned feed (approx 2/3rds rec dose on bottle)


Checked in on the girls today and things have gotten worse...



Lots more of the leaves now seem to be showing the P def symptoms, also quite a few of the lowest fan type leaves turned completely yellow, some almost white and dropped off.

Could this just be a progression of the initial problem, and the pk13/14 has just not had time to be absorbed and utilised by the plant yet or could this be some kind of lockout?

Im also wondering if maybe Im seeing multiple problems here, could they have run out of N as well as the P def?






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I think I have a bigger problem to deal with now though as I noticed a distinct musty/damp washing smell coming from one cluster of poorly spaced buds in the corner of one of the screens, I cant see anything that looks wrong in this area, but then again, I dont really know what im looking for



Im thinking maybe these def problems might have lowered the plants defences and let something nasty in

How can I sort this out as I REALLY cant afford to lose these




Thanks for all your help

I think you said this is a soil grow, yes? If so, responses take a while longer than hydro or coco coir. IIRC you said you've inspected for pests, at this point I suggest being absolutely certain--use yellow sticky traps to monitor the area.

Lowers yellowing is indeed typically an N-, so perhaps the whole feed needs slight bumping up. Go easy on it!

Thanks Seamaiden

Checked them this morning and they look like they've settled down a bit now, they're not looking any worse today.

Have already been busy this morning, went out and bought a small fan to blow some air around inside the cab as well as picking up a cheap hygrometer.

My rh is at 40 in the canopy, is this ok or not as there is still a damp smell coming from one of the corners.

Also picked up some "bud rot stop" while I was at the shop, I'm hoping this will prevent my crop turning into a cupboard full of mouldy mush! Anyone have any experience of this product:

http://www.growell.co.uk/bud-rot-stop.html

....also dropped a pest strip in as u mentioned

Thanks again for the help

You mean a sticky trap, right? Not a No Pest Strip.

I'd flush the plants with the same amount of water as the amount of soil in the container. Then give them a healthy mixed dose of veg and flower nutrients. You may have a buildup in your soil which is locking out specific things the plants want. The flush will fix that, and the mixed dose of nutrients will give them what they've been missing.

-Funk

SeaMaiden said:

You mean a sticky trap, right? Not a No Pest Strip.

Click to expand...

I didn't realise there was a difference.

This is what I have:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B002EA3UII


@funk

I'm hoping to get through this grow without having to flush, but if things don't improve over the next week I suppose I'll be left with no choice.

Ok, fly strips are a start. They're not the easiest/best to use, IMO, because they just capture what happens to land, instead of being an attractive color (there are also blue stickies for bugs that like that color for whatever reason). But they'll let you monitor whatever lands on them.

What I'm talking about are these things: http://www.groworganic.com/sticky-blue-yellow-trap-4-pk.html

..ah, ok, I will invest in some of those at some point, the idea of not trying to unglue a fly strip from my arm hairs every time I shove my hand in the cupboard is quite appealing

On a side note, the plants are looking and smelling much better today. Gonna give them a bit extra in their feed tonight and see how they handle it. Thanks for all your advice, its been invaluable