does anyone bottom feed Coco?

Guest · Jul 22, 2007

Thanks -VT- you have inspired me to use botanicare coco...

Im interested in bottom feeding, though not 100% sure it's "best" for coco.
I would like to build a self-watering tub, like an earthbox or autopot tub style, but I have concerns about pre-harvest flushing.

If I were to water from the bottom and add nutes every other fill, or every third fill would this be an improved feeding schedule?

What are your thoughts on passive bottom feeding adding 1/3 perlite?

Guest · Jul 22, 2007

Knna! Thanks for the input. What is "NS" did you mean NZ as in Nitrazyme <sp?

Did you flush for the last 2 weeks? Was the flush from the bottom too?

So, if I feed full strength, I sould space out feeding will plain water, but if I use lower solution, i can feed everytime... Good, good.

-VT- · Jul 24, 2007

I have never bottom fed....

I have never bottom fed....

1st of all, I'd listen to anything knna has to post...he knows his stuff

And he's helped me understand some things around here....that was some great advice sounds like. :joint:

I'd worry about root rot in extreme heat....but that's just me...

I'd contact boncarver_OG....if he does not chime in, as he has experience with that and just about everything else....he's experimented in coco a bunch....check his posts/threads also

johnny chimpo and others have experience with autopots....

A big inspiration for me was Jinxie, a member who deleted his handle and left the site. He was the first I saw post on bottom feeding....By the way.....Jinxie laid down a few posts in the stickied coco growers thread...do a search for him in the thread and filter his posts, you'll learn a lot....

He's Suby now.....moderating in the organic soil forum....could always shoot the guy a PM, I suppose....I never did.... 'cause he was not here, lol....so I just studied his posts over and over and still refer back to them....his posts have had a large impact on me

Guest · Jul 25, 2007

Thanks -VT-! Do you know what this "NS" that knna speaks of is?

pumpkin2006 · Jul 25, 2007

Yup, I ebb n' flow coco in 10" square pots on a root mat with hydroton between pots, flood 2x a day (could do 1x) and have 0 problems with it.

-VT- · Jul 25, 2007

I hope folks reading this understand the differences between "passive bottom feeding" , which is a capillary function...as opposed to a flood/drain, i.e ebb & flow...

For handwaterers, we can fill up a drain saucer and the coir will soak the shit up....I tried that once on a mid size plant...actually by accident cause I didn't empty the drain saucer after watering

Anyways the coir sucked it back up

Hydro "bottom feeding" and the soil application are not the same....

The key is not to overfert....pure coco would be more suitable (IMO) for a passive bottom feed, capillary, wick....whatever you wanna call it...

:2cents:

Guest · Jul 25, 2007

I have noticed that the size of the plant makes a huge difference in watering times for coco so if they where all in the same table, so if you have different strains or sized plants this may not be a good idea as they would needed to be flooded at different times. I'm just using pbp + bcuss coco an experiment

.

-VT- · Jul 25, 2007

Good observation, slips....but that's easily handled with either a gravity float for topping off, or a larger container for larger plants.....and a larger reservoir under the pot (i.e. a bigger drain tray)...or sitting a plant container inside a rubbermaid...elevating the levels to accomodate consumption....

With low RH% this could burn plants.....the key is not to overfert

Surprised Johnny Chimpo hasn't chimed in, as he has a few grows with autopots under his belt...I'll look for the thread he posted in and link it here if I can find it and remember, etc....

Lol....I was just thinking about the waterbowls/foodbowls for pets while we're out of town...gravity....simple though

Guest · Jul 26, 2007

-VT- said:
I hope folks reading this understand the differences between "passive bottom feeding" , which is a capillary function...as opposed to a flood/drain, i.e ebb & flow...

yes. It's the "passive bottome feeding" info that Im after. Like the autopots.

-VT- said:
For handwaterers, we can fill up a drain saucer and the coir will soak the shit up....I tried that once on a mid size plant...actually by accident cause I didn't empty the drain saucer after watering Anyways the coir sucked it back up

Would salt build up too quickly if you let the run-off get sucked back into the coir? I thought that the reason for run-off is to get some exess out. Am I wrong?

Johnny Chimpo · Jul 26, 2007

Good to see you VT :wave:

Alright I'm here

I have some experience with the Autopot. I will answer any questions I can. The D-39 SCROG link in my sig is a good representation of the autopot. If you do a search on ICmag for Autopot I have posted plenty of info about them...one thread was "whats the deal with these Autopots" by Cheetos...some misinformation in the beginning of the thread from a few people.

I personally use them because I can't always tend to my plants because of my schedule and the simplicity.

I use 60/40 coco/perlite. One thing I find very important is to keep the reservoir oxygenated with a powerhead or airstone or the solution will get stale. I use a modified lucas formula for coco from GratefulH3ad. I also am using a tiny air stone in the bottom of the Autopot this run just cause it couldn't hurt and the air pump had two outlets. I use a 1/2" feed line from the reservoir with the 1/4" feed lines coming off of that to the Autopots. I have a shutoff valve on the outside of the reservoir going into a 1/2" inline filter and a shutoff valve before each Autopot. I purchased everything from Futuregarden except the 1/4" shutoff valves which came from BGHydro. I use Botanicares Coir block but I don't remember where I got it.

Here are a couple pics of some plants done in the Autopot.

Two D-39 Day 31 Flower in one Autopot

D-39 Day 58

Strawberry Diesel Day 40

Checkout the link in my sig for some more info...I usually flush with pH balance water the last couple weeks. I'm thinking about picking up some Smartgardens for veg from Futuregarden...same principle as the Autopot but would work great for veg IMO.

JC

Edit: Here are a couple links :yes:

whats the deal with these autopots?

The last post in this thread explains how they work with pics...the info is from Futuregardens website.

Need ideas for automated watering system

-VT- · Jul 26, 2007

dasme said:
Would salt build up too quickly if you let the run-off get sucked back into the coir? I thought that the reason for run-off is to get some exess out. Am I wrong?

There would run up not run off

If it were me I'd only fill the "bottom feed saucer/container" when the plants need it...letting the coco dry out between refills (not bone dry...but a lil' dry)

Again...the key is to feed low PPM's....light feedings with that approach IMO

*Root rot has a harder time attacking air roots....and pythium won't proliferate if it's dry....if it's hot and the medium is always soaking wet (especially if fungus gnats are around)...you could get root rot

Johnny Chimpo · Jul 26, 2007

-VT- said:
Again...the key is to feed low PPM's....light feedings with that approach IMO

^^^I agree ^^^

The Autopot does let the medium dry out quite a bit before it refills. I would make sure if you go with the Autopot to use the same clones in each Autopot so they have the same needs and the Autopot refills at the correct time for both.

JC

Guest · Jul 26, 2007

Im assuming that "Low PPMs" is determined by the plants, right? Just high enough to keep them lush, but low enough to not need to flush. OH! that rhymed!

Sir Chimpo, with the capilary method of feeding do you ever flush with plain water at any point in the grow, or just at the end? Or do you go low ppms all the way to chop?
I noticed that you mentioned it in that other thread. How exactly do You go about flushing?

Ah Tzul · Jul 26, 2007

your girls will always tell u what u need, just listen.

don't forget coco is hydro. plain(tap?) water may be ok, but don't use RH water to flush. it will destroy your roots. I use Clearex from Botanicare, but i don't have 80% runoff, more like 10.
if u just stick with low PPMs throughout, u shouldn't have a prob with ur "run-up" being too salty

Johnny Chimpo · Jul 27, 2007

I agree that if you keep the ppm low enough you shouldn't need to flush...it's all about watching the plants...mine might be overfed from time to time...currently I only flush at the end for the last couple weeks. I was running the D-39 at half strength with GH 3 part from the directions on the back of the bottle before I switched to H3ads recipe. I didn't have any problems running the D-39 or Strawberry Diesel (cept something unrelated to the StD). This is my first run with H3ads recipe.

When I move to my new location I will be setting up a separate reservoir with plain pH balance water for flushing in the middle of the grow. I honestly have no room for another rubbermaid container in my current spot. I'll experiment with flushing at different intervals...probably every couple weeks for a few days to start with...I'll run the H2O hose parallel to the nutrient hose and be able to switch each autopot back and forth easily. This will probably be my last SCROG for awhile...probably be running around 10 plants perpetual after this.

JC

Guest · Jul 27, 2007

Just to get it clear.

Just to get it clear.

Just so that I fully understand, sorry if I seem slow :bashhead:

...
By "flush" you mean feed plaiin water for a few waterings just to get the plant to used the exess food in the coir, right?

If so I could do this very thing in a passive capilary feeding system and be fine...

Im a little nervous about this coir thing, and I like to know EXACTLY what Im doing before I get into new things. I know exp. is the true teacher, but you all are teachers too.

Confidence level rising at an alarming rate!

Johnny Chimpo · Jul 28, 2007

dasme said:
Just so that I fully understand, sorry if I seem slow ...
By "flush" you mean feed plaiin water for a few waterings just to get the plant to used the exess food in the coir, right?

Yep...that's what I meant. I haven't noticed any problems but would like to experiment...I think it would help but don't know for sure yet.

I'm usually always trying to improve and always learning. I really like the Autopots...some people don't...but I've had excellent results and really like the simplicity. I usually go camping and on vacation a few times a year or can't get to my room everyday (I do try though) and they work great for that.

JC

-VT- · Jul 28, 2007

Different reasons for flushing....in this case...

Different reasons for flushing....in this case...

I agree with the others....

In a setup like this one you're considering, I think flushing is just not practical....handwatering drain to waste gives me the advantage of feeding immediately after flush, using less volume as the medium is saturated, thus fewer nutes consumed.......and the plants don't "miss a meal"...can't take that approach in a passive setup

It's much easier to monocrop....

A fine grade coco like the Botanicare cocogro is perfect for this application

You're better off not flushing, unless you get lockout....could always remove plant from the system and flush it...isolat it and flush it if you run multiple strains and someone gets unhappy

peace

Guest · Jul 28, 2007

The container is 10gallons, But the res in this setup can only hold a gallon or so. Ill have to top water a bit regaurdless.

bluewonder999 · Oct 5, 2007

low ppms is the wayto go

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