Amending southern clay soil

[stratmandu]

Looking for alternative to filling a hole with a mix hauled in. Unused soil would stick out and would have to be hauled off and scattered - too much work. I'd like to amend in place to minimize material hauling and exposure in the area. Dig, amend, mulch to hide, get out. Return a month later to plant. Soil is heavy red high clay content typical of the SE above the fall line. I need easily obtainable stuff you might find at typical big-box HW store and commercial nurseries/landscape supplies.

Thinking of adding Pro-Mix (or coco?) to loosen, and adding perlite and/or a pumice product I found for aeration and drainage. Ferts will be Bio-tone, Plant-tone, guano, some lime and azomite. I can probably only pack in and dig one big hole at a time, and I plan on 3-4 plants per hole to account for deer predation and males. I can pre-mix the ferts and amendments and haul it in in 5-gal buckets or trash bags. I want to minimize the weight and bulk as much as possible.

Maybe I could use coco bricks and perlite for the ultimate lightweight solution. There is a stream nearby for hydrating/rinsing the coco, or can I just mix it in and let the rain expand it? Will a brick fill up a 5-cal bucket? Or do I need a trash can? Seems easiest to just put fert mix and coco bricks in a bucket, and just throw a trashbag of perlite over my shoulder. If I didn't use coco, I'm thinking I'd need at least half a bale of pro-mix to drag as well. Any comments or ideas welcome.

 

[FunkBomb]

Lowes has a good selection of soil amendments. I go there each spring to buy mushroom compost, cow manure, and peat moss to amend my vegetable garden. I also use the Espoma Garden Tone 3-4-4 as a top dress or sometimes when I'm tilling.

Pro-mix is great, but for your situation I think it's a little much. Same with the coco. You can make clay soils great with some good organic material and a shovel.

-Funk

 

[stratmandu]

Yeah I used the mushroom compost before its good stuff, a little heavy. Same with EWC I found at Pike's. Think it will drain/breathe ok without perlite? Don't want it to compact too much over the long season...

 

[badbeans]

I used this stuff for my guerilla grow last year combined with a little dolomite lime and homemade compost, plants grew great. I topdressed with high phosporus guano for flowering. Its maybe a little more expensive than the espoma stuff but I would use it again. Check it out... http://www.garden.com/item/plant-bo...-B21C-DF11-AE5B-0019B9C2BEFD&mr:referralID=NA

A little perlite mixed in would help. If you are concerned with your clay soil you should read this post https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=198782

might just give you a few new ideas...

bb

 

[stratmandu]

I've read everything posted in this forum, esp DS T's posts. My experience with this heavy red stuff does not jive with his theories, and is different than farther south where I'm on sandy loam. Thanks. Just have one spot I need to do a quick in and out style on. It needs some humus and some drainage then it should grow good. Got the sun and water covered...just need to fix up this red gumbo.

 

[D.S. Toker. MD]

Hey Stratmandu,!

There are several different varieties of clay that range from a brownish red to a grayish blue. The nature of the clay is critical to ammending it. Generally, the redish brown clays have good nutrient content, but their density can make it hard for a plant to access. Drainage can be a problem but in my opinion, perlite with perhaps some large particle construction sand should fix that problem. I dig my holes a little deeper and wider in clay because if you modify only the soil in your planting hole, the clay below it and around it can still retain too much water and force saturation of the planting hole.

Ph may be your biggest issue in my mind. Clay can be acidic or nuetral but without knowing what yours is, you might be shooting in the dark. Maybe you know- if not, can you get a cheap test kit or draw some conclusions from the native vegetation species growing there? The test kits work ok and can give you a good idea of what you have when used properly.

Its just me, but i wouldnt add any material that absorbed or retained moisture such as peat or compost. Clays often naturally have drainage problems and adding materials that are absorbent can exacerbate the problem. I would use particulate material to fix the soil texture.

Good luck with whatever you end up doing!

 

[stratmandu]

Native veg is pretty lush with lots of greenbriar and other broadleaf indigenous plants. Ph is around 5.7-6.0. Color is reddish brown, lots of iron oxide I guess. It has some sand content in it when I shake a jar of it with water and let it settle out. Creek crossing a power line right-of-way; doesn't look like they do any mowing; still lots of dead down trees since the line was built about 5-6 years ago.

 

[D.S. Toker. MD]

Gosh Stratmandu, if the native veg is like that the soil sounds fairly good to me. If its really mucky clay, there wouldnt be anything but pine seedlings and scrub bush in it. It must have decent nutrition.
The ph is way too low though. If it were me, i would go out today,(or soon) and add 1 cup of a quality lime,(Epsoma's garden lime/Penningtons fast acting) per planting hole. It needs about 30 days to work in before planting. Mix it in good though because unlike nutes, lime doesnt really leach into the soil. That 1 cup should raise the ph 1 whole point which would be just about right. Perlite will add a little calcium and loosen it up with a little const. sand or pea gravel.

Its just my 2cents, but fixing your soil isnt going to take much.

 

[stratmandu]

I hope you are right because my best genetics are going in this spot. I can't explain it without giving away too much info, but this place will have no trespassers, hunters, nothing. Almost guaranteed. I couldn't stop laughing when I was diggin' holes! It was effing funny - my dog was even all happy and frisky and started digging too. He was chewin' dirt I swear.

There will be 4-5 plants per (big) hole which will be culled to 2 fems max per hole later in the year at preflower. The deer usually cull a few for me, greedy bitches. Extra fems will go into predated holes. I should run about 40% survival rate worst case and even so this will be a sphincter-tightening haul if I pull it off!

EDIT to clarify: the area was lush last year. Right now its all brown but the greenbriar, which is wicked; I have cuts all over my legs and arms and had to dig out thorns with a needle. I don't care.

 

[Skully]

If you go to any Big Box garden centers, they should have a soil test kit for about $5 or less it has ph, fert, and amendment charts after you get your sample and test it , you will know without guessing what you need . I use them every year with sucess .

 

[s13sr20det]

expanded shale

http://www.organic-gardening-shop.com/Agorganics/Product_Details.aspx?ProductID=554


http://aggie-horticulture.tamu.edu/...hortupdate_archives/2003/nov03/Expdshale.html

"Based on a two-year research study and six years of field trials, I feel that expanded shale will open up and aerate heavy, sticky clay soils faster than any material that I have ever tested. Due to its porous nature, it provides aeration from within the shale particles and, in poorly aerated clay soils, resulted in a more extensive and healthier root system than did other treatments being tested....Even though I dearly love finished, plant-based compost, if I were limited to only one application of one soil amendment with which to open up heavy clay soils, I would take expanded shale and never look back!"

 

[:-(]

NC State on southern red clay soil.

HOW TO AMEND
Don't Guess: Soil Test!
A soil test will tell you exactly what nutrients your soil needs. Incorporating fertilizer and lime into a bed
is a great way to get these nutrients deep into the root zone where they are needed. The NC Department of
Agriculture & Consumer Services provides soil testing to North Carolina residents at no cost. The Durham
County Extension Center will provide you with the materials necessary for a soil test.
How Much to Use
The ideal amount of organic soil amendment is 25-50% by volume. Less than 25% will not provide enough
aeration, and more than 50% is actually detrimental to plant growth.
Digging In Amendments
Spade or till the soil to a depth of about 8" (the full length of a shovel blade). Spread a layer of organic
amendment about 2" deep over the area, and work it into the soil. Break up any clods of clay.
Spread a second 2" layer, add any necessary fertilizer or lime (as indicated by the soil test report), and work
this second layer in. Make sure that the organic matter is incorporated to the full depth of the bed.
If the soil is difficult to break up, try irrigating the area, waiting a day or two, then spading again. The
wetting and drying process helps break up clods. Clay soil is easiest to till when it is slightly moist. Don’t
dig if the clay is wet and sticky.
Raised Beds
Raising the bed's level above the surrounding soil is another good way to improve drainage, and it happens
naturally when adding soil amendments. Simply rake the amended soil into a smooth berm, or build an
edge. The amended soil will settle somewhat as the organic material decomposes. If a level surface is
desired, take away some of the amended soil for use elsewhere on your property.


....


RECOMMENDEND SOIL AMENDMENT MATERIALS

Compost (Humus)
Municipal Compost & Mulch
Purchased Compost (Humus)
Pine Bark Soil Conditioner
Composted Manure
Gravel

NOT Recommended: Peat, Moss
NOT Recommended: Sand
NOT Recommended: Gypsum
NOT Recommended: Fresh Manure
NOT Recommended: Fresh Wood Chips or Sawdust

MAYBE: "Topsoil"

 

[greenman04]

N.C state southern red clay

N.C state southern red clay

Dud was reading that very same article just yesterday. Carolina in the house. This clay is bummer.

 

[Wolff]

I've had good success with my own mix in clay soil. I get a bale of peat and add four 8 quart bags of perlite, 6 cups lime, couple cups of greensand, azomite and rock phosphate. Or whatever I have on hand. The top few inches of my soil is usually pretty rich soil followed by heavy red clay. May be different where you are.

Then dig a good size hole saving as much of the good topsoil as I can then I mix that with my own mixture and add a 1/4 of medium sized water polymers. This works great then when I transplant I add a handful of pellet slow release guano and they are off to the races. I also use some of the big chunks of clay as mulch. They are so thick and dense they really hold the moisture in good underneath. Not always the best for camo but you can add grasses or something ontop to cut down on the visibility.