GrnMtnGrwr gets back into growing! 400w HPS Stealth Cabinet Construction Log

[GrnMtnGrwr]

Cabinet

old....current

A 36" wide, 20" deep cabinet from Lowe's that stands 70" tall. It costs $198, and I'll be paying an additional $20 for
a large piece of 1/2" MDF. I will be installing electromagnetic locks on the doors for complete stealth and peace of mind.

Update: I've decided I want to grow them out as naturally as I can this first time so I see how they grow. I'll need all the
height I can get for that, so once there is a reservoir, it will be on the outside of the cabinet. This gives me an extra 20"
of growing space. I plan on topping at the 5th - 7th node, giving them a week to recover, and putting them into flower.
I'll have the 400w as close as I can the entire time, and arrange them so the taller ones are on the outside so I can utilize
the light I have best without doing any training besides the one topping.

Ventilation

I've used DIY carbon filters but want to try out the real thing this time. I'll be using a CAN33 paired with a 4" Vortex.
This will be extracting air from a DIY reflector, with anywhere from < 3" to as much as 15" of straight 4" ducting, no
turns between intake and exhaust for maximum efficiency of the fan. If it doesn't work out I'll have to get a 6" Vortex,
but let's hope not. I'll be using two 8"x8" darkroom louvers, I haven't decided on their location yet, I'll decide when I
finalize the rest of my plans for the cabinet. The Can33 will be in a storage box or file box or something like that without a top.

Lighting



The reflector I'm putting together will be using 5 sheets of 1'x2' leathergrain style aluminum. Something like this from Home
Depot, at $10.61 a sheet. I'll need tin snips to cut out the pieces, a ruler, protractor, marker, and some nuts, bolts, and
washers to keep everything together. Some white high heat spray paint and some high heat duct tape to make sure
everything is sealed up. The shape was made with my cabinet dimensions and setup in mind. The sole exhaust for the
cabinet is 3" above the 400w HPS. I think this is my best chance for keeping it cool with the fan I have currently, and if I
have to upgrade to a 6", it should be kept very cool.

Feeding

I'll be following The Recipe with maybe a few slight modifications due to my feeding style. I'll be buying a Tropf Blumat Patio
Kit for use in flower. I want my main reservoir to be on the ground, but I want to have the most available space in the cabinet
for growing. For this, I'm going to have my main reservoir outside the cabinet, with a system to keep a mini 1 gallon reservoir
inside the cabinet act as my feeding reservoir for the Tropf Blumat. Once I've figured out how much water they use with this
watering/feeding method, I'm planning on getting one large enough to last for the entire feeding cycle, so there will be a total
of 6 res changes per run.

I'm planning on hand feeding and transplanting up until they're in the 1.7 gallon square pots. (7.6"x7.6"x9.5")
My planned transplant progression is starter cell > beer cup > 2 liter > 1.7 gallon.

Flowering

I plan on flowering in the 2 liter bottles, and when the females show sex I will transplant them, and when the males do I will most
likely put together a male isolation chamber, and stuff them all in there and collect the mixed pollen until I've got a decent amount.
This is just hobby breeding, so I'm not too focused on male selection this time around. Once I've collected the pollen, I'm planning on
dusting the lower half of each girl. This is part of the reason I've decided to grow them out with minimal training. This will also help me
decide which seeds I want to run first, as I will have a more even comparison than if everything were LSTed into a weave of branches.

Shopping List

$120 - 400w HPS (Ballast, Bulb, Socket, Wiring)
$50 - DIY Reflector
$250 - Cabinet
===========
$420 to get my cabinet running

$166 - Can 33 Carbon Filter
$56 - Nutes (GH FloraBloom, GH FloraMicro, GH KoolBloom Powder)
$40 - Eight 7.6" Square Pots
===========
$272 more to grow

$150 - Electromagnetic Locks
$77 - Tropf Blumat Patio Kit
$50 - Top-it-Off Kit Premium
===========
$277 more to complete

I'll be reusing the Vortex, some coco bricks, and the light louvers, which is about $150~

Total Est. Cost = $1119

Conclusion

I'd love to hear any opinions on my thoughts, good or bad. Nothing is solid yet, and if there are improvements that could be made,
I'd like to hear them. Share your opinion! Thanks for reading my thread!

If anyone wants the file for use in Sketchup, feel free to download it here!

 

[icough2getoff]

What's up GrnMtnGrwr, looks like you've done your homework. Your plans look pretty solid to me. I love the simple, clean cabs. Only thing I'm confused about is your blumat dripper setup. I'm not clear on how you plan to have your reservoir set up but for blumats, but FYI the res needs to be elevated .5m high for every 5 meters of dripper length, so it can't sit on the ground. I also plan to use some blumats soon in my tent so I'm gonna have to figure out how to elevate a res. People also hook them up to faucets but that requires a steady stream of pressure and only delivers water obviously. You may already have this covered, everything else looks pretty solid to me. I know some 4" fans might cut it a little close but you will probably be alright if it isn't hot there. Can't wait to see this thing come together.

EDIT: I was just thinking about what you said about having a res in the cab to feed the plants. I wonder if you put a water pump on a timer going from a large res on the floor going up to a smaller res sitting on the top of the cab with a float valve. That might be a solution and I wonder if that's what you meant.

 

[gdbud]

nice design

 

[GrnMtnGrwr]

ic2 - Thanks for stopping by! The "Top-it-Off Kit Premium" is the answer to that question. It's a little kit with electric float valve, relay, etc to maintain a constant water level in one container, fed from another container. The mini res in the cabinet will be kept at a constant level, fed from the main res down on the floor. As you can see in my shopping list, this is one of the last things I'll be getting, I might just handwater the whole run and end up not getting it, but I would like to have it set up once I get into flowering.

It's looking like I'll be able to buy all the essentials by this time next week, so I might have the cabinet up and running and ready to go before the seeds even get here!

Thanks for checking it out gdbud!

 

[gdbud]

Sketchup is a great tool for designing cabinets. I went through like 4 or 5 designs with it before I build my cabinet. And my cabinet looks just like the finished design.
Take a look at my grow journal to see both the design and finished cabinet.
http://www.icmag.com/modules/Journal/viewentry.php?journalid=393

 

[GrowerGoneWild]

Gawd, I just love that drawing.. great info on sketchup.

This looks like a well thought out cabinet I love it!

+K!

 

[jawnroot]

Looks and sounds solid.

I'm sure you know this already, but putting together new cabs and doing a lot of DYI can be time consuming and frustrating. You might save yourself some headaches by getting as much pre-fab stuff as you can swing.

The reflector would be a good one to buy off the shelf, and for the amount of money you're paying for the Lowes cabinet, you can get a very nice grow tent with a better footprint. Food for thought.

I ran a 400 in a cab almost the exact size as what you're working with. The rectangular shape was a hindrance, but if you plan to do sea of green, it shouldn't be as much of an issue. A tent might be a better solution either way, unless that's not possible for stealth reasons.

Regarding feeding, etc, I'm not sure what medium or system of growing you're using from above (assuming coco w. rez's formula?). As opposed to dealing with a reservoir and all that implies, you would probably be better off hand watering and keeping it simple. I'm using Bontanicare's ReadyGro moisture mix (coco based). Calls for a watering about every day to every other day. It's as easy as a soil garden, but with the benefits of coco.

Getting into the more complicated options may well be more trouble than it's worth. I say this only because I just recently got back into growing myself, and quickly forgot how much time and effort is involved with getting a setup going. I'd recommend keeping everything as simple as possible. It's always easy to tweak later on as necessary.

Happy growing

 

[jawnroot]

I was reading through The Recipe thread, and noticed an interesting and applicable snippit from Rez:

...I feed by hand,with a hose and pump,no reservoir or hydro for me...

Again, just food for thought. I always love planning grows, and it seems you do as well. I have a tendency to make things overly complicated on the drawing board, only to have the plan get vastly simpler when I realize how time consuming my original design would have been.

 

[GrnMtnGrwr]

Looks and sounds solid.

Happy growing

First off, thanks for the reply!

I'm sure you know this already, but putting together new cabs and doing a lot of DYI can be time consuming and frustrating. You might save yourself some headaches by getting as much pre-fab stuff as you can swing.

The reflector would be a good one to buy off the shelf, and for the amount of money you're paying for the Lowes cabinet, you can get a very nice grow tent with a better footprint. Food for thought.

I ran a 400 in a cab almost the exact size as what you're working with. The rectangular shape of was a hindrance, but if you plan to do sea of green, it shouldn't be as much of an issue. A tent might be a better solution either way, unless that's not possible for stealth reasons.

I've made a reflector extremely similar to this before, and it's very easy. Mark a few lines, make a few cuts, and spray some paint. You can have a reflector that is customized for your grow space. A grow tent is a lot less stealthy than a cabinet, and if all goes according to plan someone could be standing a foot away from my cabinet and not notice anything at all.

About the footprint - How would square be better? Rectangular footprint matches the output of the bulb. They put off much more light side to side than front to back, and reflectors (my DIY and most retail) seem to fit with the rectangular output.

Regarding feeding, etc, I'm not sure what medium or system of growing you're using from above (assuming coco w. rez's formula?). As opposed to dealing with a reservoir and all that implies, you would probably be better off hand watering and keeping it simple. I'm using Bontanicare's ReadyGro moisture mix (coco based). Calls for a watering about every day to every other day. It's as easy as a soil garden, but with the benefits of coco.

Yeah, 70% coco, 30% perlite, using Rez's formula. I've done coco handwatered and automated recirculating drip. I will definitely be hand watering until 12/12 at least, but once they get into bud production and the roots have fully taken advantage of the container size, a constant moisture level would be better for the plants, imo. I could do that a few different ways.

1. Hempy buckets - I've done this before, and I really like it. Water once a week~ and maintains a constant moisture level. No reservoir, no pumps, no timers. Definitely my preferred simple approach. I have done this before and I like it a lot.

2. Recirculating Drip - I've done this once, no complaints really, but wasn't really impressed.

3. Automated Hempy Buckets - This is probably what will happen if I don't get the Tropf Blumat system. It would rely on having a mini reservoir that I can put a float valve in to keep it at a constant water level of about 1-2". All the plant containers could sit in this with 1-2" of pure perlite at the bottom, with the coco/perlite on top. When the float valve triggers, the pump would pour nutes from the main res through the tops of the containers and it would drain through to the res that all the plants sat in.

4. Tropf Blumat - These look like they have a lot of potential. They will basically do the same as hempy buckets, but in a slightly different manner. Since it can be hooked up to a reservoir, and the feeding plan I follow is basically the same thing for the first several weeks, followed by another solution for a few weeks, followed by flush, I'll be able to do as few as 3 res changes for an entire grow, without recirculating, and without any waste.

I'd like to handwater on a regular schedule like Rez, but sometimes it's not possible, so I try to plan ahead and make sure my girls don't suffer neglect.

I appreciate all the input, it's good to hear what other people think and work it into your plan. That's why I made this thread!

 

[GrnMtnGrwr]

I was reading through The Recipe thread, and noticed an interesting and applicable snippit from Rez:

...I feed by hand,with a hose and pump,no reservoir or hydro for me...

Again, just food for thought. I always love planning grows, and it seems you do as well. I have a tendency to make things overly complicated on the drawing board, only to have the plan get vastly simpler when I realize how time consuming my original design would have been.

With Tropf Blumat, there is no recirculating of nutes, and no waste. I'd probably give them a handwatering once a week or so with a little bit of runoff just to flush any buildup out, but I don't think that would even be necessary. It's too bad there isn't more information on the forums, I'll definitely be posting my results so more people can get info on it.

 

[jawnroot]

About the footprint - How would square be better? Rectangular footprint matches the output of the bulb. They put off much more light side to side than front to back, and reflectors (my DIY and most retail) seem to fit with the rectangular output.

In theory, it seems rectangular would be better. This is difficult to explain without a diagram, but suffice it to say the light produces radiation in a hemispherical pattern below the reflector. But, if you're going for stealth the square footprint debate has no real meaning for the purposes of this conversation.

If I were you, I'd go with what you know, and what's most simple. From what you've outlined, it seems Hempy buckets is the best choice.

 

[GrnMtnGrwr]

In theory, it seems rectangular would be better. This is difficult to explain without a diagram, but suffice it to say the light produces radiation in a hemispherical pattern below the reflector. But, if you're going for stealth the square footprint debate has no real meaning for the purposes of this conversation.

If I were you, I'd go with what you know, and what's most simple. From what you've outlined, it seems Hempy buckets is the best choice.

Well I hadn't really considered it too much but thanks for bringing it up, I'm definitely considering it a lot more than I had been. Thank you very much!

I'm definitely planning on this being my most successful grow, so maybe I should stick with what I know for sure.

One of my goals that I don't think I've mentioned yet is that I don't want to have to move the plants to water them. A simple tray with a drain is all I need, but it'll take up some space.

I'm still unsure on the exact dimensions, so I'm looking forward to getting the cabinet put together. I ordered the 400w setup today, and I'll be assembling the cabinet on Monday, so if all goes well the cabinet could be up and running by Monday night! That will give me some time before the seeds get here to figure out temperatures and the fine details.

 

[jawnroot]

...and I'll be assembling the cabinet on Monday, so if all goes well the cabinet could be up and running by Monday night! That will give me some time before the seeds get here to figure out temperatures and the fine details.

Nice. It's always so much fun getting a grow together (frustration with assembly aside). I've got my first seedlings in 4 years vegging. Still getting the kinks worked out of the flowering chamber, but everything should be cool once I deal with a few fairly minor issues.

Good luck with everything. Get some pics up when you build it.

 

[GrnMtnGrwr]

Nice. It's always so much fun getting a grow together (frustration with assembly aside). I've got my first seedlings in 4 years vegging. Still getting the kinks worked out of the flowering chamber, but everything should be cool once I deal with a few fairly minor issues.

Good luck with everything. Get some pics up when you build it.

Yeah it's been a little over a year since I've had any plants, I can't wait !

Good luck with yours, I'll definitely check it out, and I will be posting plenty of pics, that's a definite.

 

[FreezerBoy]

You may want to consider a small batwing reflector insert above the lamp. That's a lot of direct light to lose up the exhaust.

 

[GrnMtnGrwr]

You may want to consider a small batwing reflector insert above the lamp. That's a lot of direct light to lose up the exhaust.

Yeah I've been thinking about that. I'll have to see what other designs I can come up with that won't lose as much light, thanks for pointing that out!

 

[GrnMtnGrwr]

Well I just decided I wasn't going to be able to make the trip to get my 8"x8" louvers out of storage in the next few weeks so I went to order another pair. Out of stock! :shocked:

So I looked around, and there was a 12"x12" and a 12"x24". 12"x12" was $60~ and the 12"x24" was $85. I went with the 12"x 12" one, which gives me 144sq inches of intake.

I don't know the exact specs but I'll just say the louver is a 50% restriction on airflow. (Any info on this would be appreciated.) So we'll say I've got the equivalent of 72 square inches of unrestricted passive intake. This should allow for my 4" fan to have pretty unrestricted airflow and give it the best chances at keeping my 400w cool. (4" duct = 12.5 square inches). One intake instead of two means less cuts to make, which makes me happy.

This will also allow for leeway if I do need to go up to a 6" fan, because I'll still have at least 2x intake as exhaust when taking into account the louver restrictions. I'm planning on getting a hepa filter and cutting out an insert to fit my intake, I don't want dusty buds or buds with my cat's hair on them. That will add some more restriction to the intake but hopefully not too much, we'll see.

And here's the first thing I threw together for the hood. Still plenty of space for airflow, and should be almost no loss through the exhaust. Added a little height to it and put in a few extra strips of metal. I might have to get one or two more pieces of metal than I had originally planned, but that's alright.


Edit: Looking at it, I will probably extend the batwing all the way across instead of leaving a gap.

 

[GrnMtnGrwr]

So I've been doing some shopping.

Today I acquired...

Dutch Master Liquid Light
Dutch Master Penetrator
1 liter handheld pump sprayer
12"x12" Light-tight louver
A handful of emergency blankets (mylar)
A few cans of spray adhesive (for ^)
A paint roller (to attach ^ smoothly)
Digital Hygrometer with wireless sensor (main display on my desk, sensor in the cabinet)
High heat white spray paint for DIY Reflector


In the next two days I'll be getting...

The cabinet
The back of the cabinet
Weatherstripping
Materials for DIY Reflector

Carbon Filter
Maxicrop
GH Flora Bloom
KoolBloom Powder
7.6" square 1.7 gallon containers
A few more bricks of GH Cocotek coco

It looks like I should have my HPS setup delivered by the end of the week, my payment just arrived in the UK Monday so hopefully the seeds get sent out soon.

I've never foliared before, but I've been looking into it and I'm looking forward to trying it. There won't be a side-by-side test this time since I'm running from seed, but I'll be giving all the plants the recommended dosages of the Dutch Master products, starting off at 1/4 strength and working my way up. Like I've said before, I'm not going to half ass anything this time around. Every interior surface of the cabinet will be covered with mylar, the DIY reflector will provide the best possible footprint, and I've decided I'm going to handwater daily, because I want this to be my most successful grow.

 

[GrnMtnGrwr]

So I made what I'm hoping is my last trip to the hydro shop for quite a while, but we'll see if that turns out to be true. I picked up all this stuff...

Carbon Filter
Maxicrop
GH Flora Bloom
KoolBloom Powder
7.6" square 1.7 gallon containers
A few more bricks of GH Cocotek coco

I just need to go to Lowes and Home Depot now to get the stuff for my cabinet and reflector, and wait for everything else to arrive. I finished up the layout for my reflector and see that I'm only going to have to buy 4 sheets of metal.


It looks like my seeds might be the last things to arrive, maybe I should just start the Highend?

 

[theJointedOne]

looks like your doing everything great and are planning ahead which is very important. The high end is bomb. heres a high end white rhino nug for ya

keep it green!