The Haze discussion thread

[ojd]

Swiss Thai Nevil , made by Neville (RIP) from his grail project

Keeper 2 , 1 of those most vigourous Haze's ive ever grown.
A real beast that can drink like an Englishman.
1 of 2 keepers from the Swiss Thai Nevil that are both some of the best found in the grail project.
lots of work planned with the 2 cuts including in both Feminized projects underway now , SSSDH and Nevil Haze 21 x Mullumbimby Madness Long Fem projects.

 

[heirloomganja]

Is defoliation not strain dependent? Some will do better than others?

 

[Cvh]

Hi everyone

As posted earlier, is it possible to move the defoliating debate to the following thread?

https://www.icmag.com/forum/marijua...-growing-science/17980100-to-defoliate-or-not

Thanks.

 

[CosmicGiggle]

Hi everyone

As posted earlier, is it possible to move the defoliating debate to the following thread?

https://www.icmag.com/forum/marijua...-growing-science/17980100-to-defoliate-or-not

Thanks.

What the man sez, and in addition, no trolling, flaming or crying on ICMag!

 

[Hammerhead]

What the man sez, and in addition, no trolling, flaming or crying on ICMag!

lol

 

[star crash]

[No message]

 

[star crash]

Christmas Haze via Johnny Chicago

 

[OldCoolSativa]

That looks decidedly festive!

 

[maryjaneismyfre]

Is defoliation not strain dependent? Some will do better than others?

Yes entirely...and timing dependant, which depends on at what stage the stretch has stopped in the variety and thus also genetics dependant..Depends on planting density also..I know there is a separate thread for defoliation, I think I was posting there many years ago thinking it was hogwash, I don't anymore..

Pics below are just over 3 weeks in, first pic block not defoliated still had a defoliation as was supposed to be a side by side for this production variety of mine, but 5 days after that point it was already a shit show and we had to go in an do a light strip, 2nd pic the block that defoliated was stripped almost bare of any fan leaf except for the emerging 2 or 3 leaflets...Last pic is an under skirt pic to show pruning and bottoms clean ups that are done in any case...

Very light defoliation above..But still a fair amount of leaf removed..

This block above heavy defoliation once stretch stopped, although it does not look like it pretty much every fan leaf got removed at least a week AFTER these plants got put into flower..

That is what it looks like underneath both blocks, heavily pruned and lowers removed. You can see all the way down 40meters of table between the rows..

Sorry CVH, all further comments on this subject, after this last one, I will post in the relevant thread..

I'm just backing up hempy here, everytime he shows any sort of opinion he gets crucified...had to jump in and back him up..he is at all times just voicing an opinion which may or may not be correct and although some don't agree with him, I do here, sometimes I don't, and here because not of something I've read about and never tried, but something I've read about and that I did not then agree with, I tried, tested, experimented, measured etc..and changed my view. Defoliation can be done wrong, yes defoliation can completely be counter productive, very much so, it also is genetics dependent, some like it and some dont, and it is generally entirely related to your planting density..or the genetics inherent shade avoidance, or lack thereof..indica leaning hybrids benefitting more in my experience generally, in the right situation, sativas generally not benefitting or some not liking it at all..but some sativa's couldn't care less, one sister can not like it and her other sisters do like it...that is how it goes..but don't try it now cause I said it works or hempy said so and fuck your plants up and blame me or him either LOL...there is definitely an art to it.

In my situation, it also is part of my PM IPM as I have to grow big crops year round in among thousands of hectares of vineyards and ambient PM sporeload is pretty much through the roof except in dead of winter..and the climate suits it too. Too much leaf sweating, shading can put me in a world of trouble on a major scale pretty quickly..

Wow this is so off OP topic..so to conclude and bring it on track, in a perfect world no one would care about bag appeal or density, and also pay enough so I could do long flower crops and stil keep the lights on and staff fed, then I could just grow haze and put any mold worries behind me...and plant at a low density and the plants would auto veg anyway as haze does and I could grow them ten foot tall and ignore the cost of the real estate they are in..and then I'd have to pluck no leaf except which the plant aborts at the end of its life when ripening, just to keep things tidy....and wouldnt that be great..But its not a perfect world and we squash as much bud into the real estate as possible and sometimes the leaf gets in the way LOL, when our test blocks, as in pictures above, show that this practice or another is counter productive for whatever reason we would stop or work out again where the happy medium is. And also in this imperfect world others opinions differ from mine, and some will not agree with me on any of these points....and that's cool..it makes things interesting and keeps me learning as I don't know enough in this world and keeps interested in being alive and stops life from being boring for me...One does not have to throw a wobbly everytime someone else disagrees. people can just agree to disagree and in this case keep the spliffs and conversations rolling merrily along without attacking hempy...

I'll go take a pic tomorrow of some of sam's old haze x skunk seeds that we popped, which are flowering in testing at the moment in another part of this greenhouse and get more on topic LOL..even though that's still a haze hybrid..its an original haze hybrid!

 

[star crash]

Good post ^^^

 

[heirloomganja]

Very nice greenhouse.How big is the greenhouse you're growing maryjaneismyfre ?

 

[maryjaneismyfre]

That is one flowering compartment in the greenhouse, 1200m2 of canopy, there is another like it kitted out the same in the same greenhouse and and a mother area of 600m2 and one more flowering space sitting unused that we are yet to kit out, that planned for after this summer (S hemisphere)..and then some more non light dep. non light sup, no heating greenhouses that are from the same size, to double, to six times the size that we run for a summer crop and early winter crops..or will, the big big one we are currently retrofitting, its never grown dope, just peppers..that one is over 200m long LOL..its full on..all flowering at end summer its over a hectare under cover of canopy.. My orders for next june completed delivery, of graded top shelf, is a couple of tons of dried trimmed flower,above a certain size and of a certain density, the specifications of the orders are quite strict, well the farms orders that I responsible for growing of...We've met some of the order already arrived at market exported and we have another load trimmed, dried, and then curing while waiting for conclusion of paperwork (not my dept! LOL) waiting for export, and we are going to soon harvest another load starting this week and then this crop above in 4-5 weeks, one main strain is done just before 8 weeks same one in photos in last post, and then we actually do the main planting for the season of which then two more crops in this space and one main one in the low tech space..so we are on target at least or just ahead..and indoors too ..ja its full on..

 

[star crash]

What are the specifications for size and density?

 

[flylowgethigh]

I'll go take a pic tomorrow of some of sam's old haze x skunk seeds that we popped, which are flowering in testing at the moment in another part of this greenhouse and get more on topic LOL..even though that's still a haze hybrid..its an original haze hybrid!

I had 9 of 9 of those make tails for my run 4.1, and may run some of these also (that will be 4.2). The SSDH isn't popping.

https://www.seedbay.com/product/original-haze-love-potion-x-original-haze-skunk/

 

[Hammerhead]

haze , haze, haze

 

[maryjaneismyfre]

One of you guys with room do haze off. Side by side by side One control with every leaf intact
One with normal pruning
One with heavy defoliation.

But then we'd all argue about the definition of "normal pruning"
​​​​​

 

[heirloomganja]

Interesting to see a Haze hybrid in the greenhouse.Are those Gavita lights BTW?

 

[@hempy]

maryjaneismyfre can i ask are the flowers exported for the medical market or the recreational market (same thing in my opinion) just more curiosity than any thing.

Nice sized greenhouses by the way and a hell of a lot of responsibility.

Good posts and thanks.

 

[Chi13]

Yes entirely...and timing dependant, which depends on at what stage the stretch has stopped in the variety and thus also genetics dependant..Depends on planting density also..I know there is a separate thread for defoliation, I think I was posting there many years ago thinking it was hogwash, I don't anymore..


I'm just backing up hempy here, everytime he shows any sort of opinion he gets crucified...had to jump in and back him up..he is at all times just voicing an opinion which may or may not be correct and although some don't agree with him, I do here, sometimes I don't, and here because not of something I've read about and never tried, but something I've read about and that I did not then agree with, I tried, tested, experimented, measured etc..and changed my view. Defoliation can be done wrong, yes defoliation can completely be counter productive, very much so, it also is genetics dependent, some like it and some dont, and it is generally entirely related to your planting density..or the genetics inherent shade avoidance, or lack thereof..indica leaning hybrids benefitting more in my experience generally, in the right situation, sativas generally not benefitting or some not liking it at all..but some sativa's couldn't care less, one sister can not like it and her other sisters do like it...that is how it goes..but don't try it now cause I said it works or hempy said so and fuck your plants up and blame me or him either LOL...there is definitely an art to it.

Great post and I love your set up, and apologies for only quoting a bit of it, but didn't want to clog up the thread anymore. Very nice stepping in to help Hempy, but I think you misunderstand. Hempy makes claims from time to time that people disagree with. No one is crucifying him, just questioning some of his statements.

From what you say here the technique is strain dependent, may be beneficial, may be detrimental, works better on Indica's than Sativa's. So for me the jury is still out as to whether it works or not? By your own admission there are a lot of variables. Btw, Hempy was completely defoliating a pure Thai sativa, so from what you are saying that is likely a bad idea?

Unless you do a side by side of the same clones, under the same conditions, then you don't know for sure if it works. This would need to be repeated for various conditions and cultivars. I am not saying it doesn't work, but it seems mostly counter productive to me, if yield increase is the goal. However, if someone could show me it works backed up by true experiments, then I would do it.

Just because you are a commercial grower and you defoliate, does not make it a scientifically correct practice. There are all sorts of different commercial growers with varying grow styles, techniques etc.

 

[@hempy]

Great post and I love your set up, and apologies for only quoting a bit of it, but didn't want to clog up the thread anymore. Very nice stepping in to help Hempy, but I think you misunderstand. Hempy makes claims from time to time that people disagree with. No one is crucifying him, just questioning some of his statements.

Interesting comment Chi and i find these comment offensive.

There is a game being played out here at my expense by a few of you and i am not the only member of this forum to see it others are to and they have brought it up with me in privet.

I have spent years doing detailed grow threads and helping many growers out.

What have you done ?.